"The on-line manual is at https://docs.otoy.com/manuals/products/daz-studio/v3/"
There isn't much information there on how to use the plugin. It's just a few screen caps and a glossary. I already know what a normal map and a bump map is and I can see what the menu looks like when I'm working with it. I'm not sure what the point in this kind of documentation is.
"Rightclick the preset and "Copy as new material", then drag that new material onto a Scene Surface. It is very easy!"
If you do that with the material in the scene, it's just going to build a new material based on what's already assigned to it in Daz Studio. That's pointless. That's why I have by defualt. If you do that with a material in the live DB, it creates a unused shader. In either case, it doesn't help me assign a template to an existing shader so that I can get the settings where I need them without having to go in and edit each setting individually each time I want to edit an existing shader.
"That is incorrect. The UV mapping of the model is untouched."
It may not be the UV then, but it certainly has the same effect. I'm attaching an image to show what I'm talking about.
"Can you be more specific on this pls? I an unaware of any material editing functions that are not working."
Certainly, if you decide to paste the template, you'll find that it replaces the material name and all. Then you'll need to rename the material back to it's original name and delete the unused material unless you want to have 50 instances of "copy of wood shader (1)" that you have a hard time keeping up because the names of your materials no longer make sense (assuming you are applying the wood shader settings to 50 materials). Of course, you could drag and drop the wood shader 50 times, but you'll have the same problem. Naturally, either way you'll find that it creates the problem that the image maps no longer line up right that I referred to as the UV map having been changed. Alternatively, you could apply the settings only. This way you won't need to worry about it renaming the material and creating an unused material (actually I assume it's probably creating a new material and unassigning the old one but it's the same effect). I don't think this creates the same problem with image maps that don't line up, but it does mean that you'll have to go through and individually replace each image map for each usage of the shader. This is truly laborious if you have 50 materials you need to edit each with 3 image maps.
"You seem to be raising issue which no one else has. Have you read the manual? Have you watched the tutorials at docs.otoy.com (Getting Started->Video Catalogue)."
As I said, the manual contains no useful information unless you want to know what a normal map is without googling it. As for the videos, I think I've found the link you attempted to give me. "https://docs.otoy.com/manuals/video-catalogue/". About all I could find was a link to a youtube channel with some videos on the standalone application. "https://www.youtube.com/user/OtoyNZ/videos". None of it relates to the Daz Studio plugin.
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The practical means would be to create your template (or set up one material) on one surface of the object, then copy that created template or material to all other surfaces of the same object that share the same image maps in scene (most of which get autoassigned under one material anyway). If you are talking about using the same exact material across 50 different objects, each of which possess a different UV layout, then you would have the same problem with any shader, unless the vendor did all of the work to set the material settings up identically for each object. If you are using a template and it is reassigning maps, you have set the settings incorrectly. I assumed the naming used in the node was pretty self explanatory, which may have been incorrect, but if you are familiar with what all of the relevant things it references are, you should be able to spot the issues pretty quickly.
For any standard product you pay for that uses other rendering engines, this process is how they set up each preset for each surface, then saved so you can reapply with a double-click (which as Dr. Hemulen pointed out, you can also opt to do). Using Octane is setting up the materials yourself in nearly every instance outside of very few Daz vendors, and TRRazor's templates. If you would like a detailed, step-by-step guide to creating a tempate material, I can do one up when I get home. As far as I've seen, nearly every other function is a copy of what Octane standalone does, and is generally performed in the same way (not that I've done more than dabble with the standalone), but if you have aspecific question, I and a few others would probably be more than willing to help you break through your confusion. Linvanchene also did a bunch of tutorial threads on some basic functions here in this subforum, most of them titled with the issue or thing done, so they may help you out as well.
For any standard product you pay for that uses other rendering engines, this process is how they set up each preset for each surface, then saved so you can reapply with a double-click (which as Dr. Hemulen pointed out, you can also opt to do). Using Octane is setting up the materials yourself in nearly every instance outside of very few Daz vendors, and TRRazor's templates. If you would like a detailed, step-by-step guide to creating a tempate material, I can do one up when I get home. As far as I've seen, nearly every other function is a copy of what Octane standalone does, and is generally performed in the same way (not that I've done more than dabble with the standalone), but if you have aspecific question, I and a few others would probably be more than willing to help you break through your confusion. Linvanchene also did a bunch of tutorial threads on some basic functions here in this subforum, most of them titled with the issue or thing done, so they may help you out as well.
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"The practical means would be to create your template (or set up one material) on one surface of the object, then copy that created template or material to all other surfaces of the same object that share the same image maps in scene (most of which get autoassigned under one material anyway). If you are talking about using the same exact material across 50 different objects, each of which possess a different UV layout, then you would have the same problem with any shader, unless the vendor did all of the work to set the material settings up identically for each object. If you are using a template and it is reassigning maps, you have set the settings incorrectly. I assumed the naming used in the node was pretty self explanatory, which may have been incorrect, but if you are familiar with what all of the relevant things it references are, you should be able to spot the issues pretty quickly."
Am I misunderstanding something here? There is nothing strange about the content I'm working with. At the start, in Daz Studio, all of the UV maps are right. The image maps line up with the UV mapping correctly. There are a lot of wooden surfaces. Each surface has a different UV map and a different image and the images and UV maps line up. I want to change the settings so that it looks like wood rather than concrete with a picture of wood spray painted on it. I want to keep the UV mapping, the image maps and the material names but replace the settings so that it looks like wood. This is a very simple task and shouldn't be very difficult and shouldn't require editing each material one at a time setting by setting. This is also one of the most common tasks that I need to do.
The scene I'm showing is the same as almost any other scene out there from anyone. There are various surfaces that have various UV maps. Each surface has the correct UV map for the surface, but each surface has a different UV map and different image maps. This is going to be the same with pretty much anything, including the stuff that I make myself (though what I'm showing here wasn't made by me). Obviously what I'd like to do is to just copy the setting so that it doesn't in effect rename the material to "copy of wood shader", "copy of wood shader (1)", "copy of wood shader (2)" etc. This, as I see it, is a design flaw of the octane plugin. The bigger issue is that, if I understand correctly, the template that you make has to be designed for the particular UV map for which it will be used? If so, then there is no point in trying to use Octane. I think the problem is that I don't see a way to copy just the settings without changing the image maps. Instead, the only way to keep the image maps is to completely replace the shader which causes such an amount of problems that it's simply not an option. Thus, templates are pointless except for in very specific odd situations such as doing the shader for a standard character type (ex: Genesis 3).
If you look at something like the Reality plugin, it has a VERY simple way of dealing with this. When you apply a new shader, it doesn't redo the UV mapping. The UV mapping stays the same before and after applying any shader so if you apply a new shader (ANY new shader) and keep the old image maps they will still line up if they lined up before you changed the shader. Also, in Reality, it doesn't replace the old shader and then move it somewhere and change the name of the new shader to "copy of " and all that. It simply lets you keep the name of the material the same as it was. I was able to change materials very quickly and easily. With the setup you have here, it seems like everything takes as much time as humanly possible because at every step of the way the plugin seems to have strange ideas about what you're trying to do that I can't understand. I don't understand why it changes the name of the material. I don't understand why it wants to change the UV mapping, especially when I'm using a template. I don't understand what this thing is attempting to do. I've worked with Maya. I've worked with Daz Studio. I've done my own UV mapping for some pretty complex objects. I have never seen anything like this before.
It seems to be designed with the idea in mind that you either want to change settings for each material one by one, or you want to completely replace the shader image maps, UVs and all. I want to change the shader settings but not the image maps. You might think that a template would do that, and the template does keep the image map, but since it changes the UV mapping there is no reason why templates exist unless you have lots of objects with EXACTLY the same UV mapping. It hinders that feature to the point of being basically pointless.
Am I misunderstanding something here? There is nothing strange about the content I'm working with. At the start, in Daz Studio, all of the UV maps are right. The image maps line up with the UV mapping correctly. There are a lot of wooden surfaces. Each surface has a different UV map and a different image and the images and UV maps line up. I want to change the settings so that it looks like wood rather than concrete with a picture of wood spray painted on it. I want to keep the UV mapping, the image maps and the material names but replace the settings so that it looks like wood. This is a very simple task and shouldn't be very difficult and shouldn't require editing each material one at a time setting by setting. This is also one of the most common tasks that I need to do.
The scene I'm showing is the same as almost any other scene out there from anyone. There are various surfaces that have various UV maps. Each surface has the correct UV map for the surface, but each surface has a different UV map and different image maps. This is going to be the same with pretty much anything, including the stuff that I make myself (though what I'm showing here wasn't made by me). Obviously what I'd like to do is to just copy the setting so that it doesn't in effect rename the material to "copy of wood shader", "copy of wood shader (1)", "copy of wood shader (2)" etc. This, as I see it, is a design flaw of the octane plugin. The bigger issue is that, if I understand correctly, the template that you make has to be designed for the particular UV map for which it will be used? If so, then there is no point in trying to use Octane. I think the problem is that I don't see a way to copy just the settings without changing the image maps. Instead, the only way to keep the image maps is to completely replace the shader which causes such an amount of problems that it's simply not an option. Thus, templates are pointless except for in very specific odd situations such as doing the shader for a standard character type (ex: Genesis 3).
If you look at something like the Reality plugin, it has a VERY simple way of dealing with this. When you apply a new shader, it doesn't redo the UV mapping. The UV mapping stays the same before and after applying any shader so if you apply a new shader (ANY new shader) and keep the old image maps they will still line up if they lined up before you changed the shader. Also, in Reality, it doesn't replace the old shader and then move it somewhere and change the name of the new shader to "copy of " and all that. It simply lets you keep the name of the material the same as it was. I was able to change materials very quickly and easily. With the setup you have here, it seems like everything takes as much time as humanly possible because at every step of the way the plugin seems to have strange ideas about what you're trying to do that I can't understand. I don't understand why it changes the name of the material. I don't understand why it wants to change the UV mapping, especially when I'm using a template. I don't understand what this thing is attempting to do. I've worked with Maya. I've worked with Daz Studio. I've done my own UV mapping for some pretty complex objects. I have never seen anything like this before.
It seems to be designed with the idea in mind that you either want to change settings for each material one by one, or you want to completely replace the shader image maps, UVs and all. I want to change the shader settings but not the image maps. You might think that a template would do that, and the template does keep the image map, but since it changes the UV mapping there is no reason why templates exist unless you have lots of objects with EXACTLY the same UV mapping. It hinders that feature to the point of being basically pointless.
You are confusing some terms, quite a bit, actually. A UV map is how an image aligns along the polygons making up a surface, to change it, you have to create an entirely new one in a modelling program (i.e. Maya or Blender). Daz Studio and the Octane plugin do not do this. An image map not aligned to that UV will display oddly, because the image does not align with that UV (this is the situation you keep referring to as changing the UV, which is incorrect. You are changing the image map to a map not aligned with the unchanged UV). If you set up a template material correctly, it is using the settings of the material while replacing the image maps (which are aligned to the UV correctly). That is the entire point of the templating system. If your templates are changing the maps to something not intended, they are not set up correctly for what you want, as I stated. The renaming is an internal function, and incredibly easy to fix, as you pointed out. If that particularly bothers you, I have no good solution for that, so I'll leave that up to Face_off, should he choose to address it. When I get home, I will go ahead and write up a step by step guide to setting up a template for a few alternate scenarios, and maybe that will clear up some confusion over them, but it will be a few hours at least, unfortunately. I'm assuming how I present the information is somehow lacking without images to reference, so hopefully that will help clarify things a bit, with an unfortunate delay, unless someone else gets around to it in the meantime.
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I have the correct image maps. The image map hasn't changed. I used to have the right base image map but some of the other image maps wrong. Now I have fixed that issue but I'm still experiencing the same issue. I'm not sure what's going on. I will try and find out what's going on.
For example, if I have a preset I need to edit, I would like to be able to just open it up in node graph editor and make changes to it directly. Unfortunately, I couldn't find a way to do that. Therefore, I had to create a box, assign the preset to it, edit the preset, delete the old preset, create a new preset by the same name. Ultimately, yes, I was able to make the edit, but it's a very circuitous rout to take.
For example, if I have a preset I need to edit, I would like to be able to just open it up in node graph editor and make changes to it directly. Unfortunately, I couldn't find a way to do that. Therefore, I had to create a box, assign the preset to it, edit the preset, delete the old preset, create a new preset by the same name. Ultimately, yes, I was able to make the edit, but it's a very circuitous rout to take.
Ok, I cracked it. It had nothing to do with the image maps. It had nothing to do with the template. All of that was fine. What was causing the problem was a 2D Transformation node feeding into the UV Transformation input on the image mage. The image map it's self was fine, but it was being modified by a 2D transformation node. I stand by what I said about there being a lot of things about the plugin that are very user unfriendly, but I think I can make it work. I may make a post at some point just pointing out all of the ways I think the plugin could be edited to make it far more user friendly.
Regarding the UV mapping - I'm still unclear on what the issue was. It's not a problem that has been reported by other users. If you send me a sample scene which illustrates the issue I can take a closer look.
Paul
I can see 6 DAZStudio specific tutorial videos in that section. Are you looking in the right place?As for the videos, I think I've found the link you attempted to give me. "https://docs.otoy.com/manuals/video-catalogue/". About all I could find was a link to a youtube channel with some videos on the standalone application. "https://www.youtube.com/user/OtoyNZ/videos". None of it relates to the Daz Studio plugin.
Paul
Win7/Win10/Mavericks/Mint 17 - GTX550Ti/GT640M
Octane Plugin Support : Poser, ArchiCAD, Revit, Inventor, AutoCAD, Rhino, Modo, Nuke
Pls read before submitting a support question
Octane Plugin Support : Poser, ArchiCAD, Revit, Inventor, AutoCAD, Rhino, Modo, Nuke
Pls read before submitting a support question
- linvanchene
- Posts: 783
- Joined: Mon Mar 25, 2013 10:58 pm
- Location: Switzerland
Update/edit:
put in the proper term "unlisted" instead o "private"
@ Videos
-> This means:
- They do not show up in any youtube search
- They do not show up in the "Videos" section of the Otoy New Zealand Section
- You can only watch the unlisted videos if someone sends you a link
or
they are part of a published playlist, which luckily they are:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... alOk_XNckJ
- - -
Toggling the videos from unlisted to public would make it easier for new users to find them.
- - -
put in the proper term "unlisted" instead o "private"
@ Videos
It appears currently all OctaneRender for Daz Studio videos are set to "unlisted"I can see 6 DAZStudio specific tutorial videos in that section. Are you looking in the right place?As for the videos, I think I've found the link you attempted to give me. "https://docs.otoy.com/manuals/video-catalogue/". About all I could find was a link to a youtube channel with some videos on the standalone application. "https://www.youtube.com/user/OtoyNZ/videos". None of it relates to the Daz Studio plugin.
Paul
-> This means:
- They do not show up in any youtube search
- They do not show up in the "Videos" section of the Otoy New Zealand Section
- You can only watch the unlisted videos if someone sends you a link
or
they are part of a published playlist, which luckily they are:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... alOk_XNckJ
- - -
Toggling the videos from unlisted to public would make it easier for new users to find them.
- - -
Last edited by linvanchene on Mon Nov 21, 2016 8:59 am, edited 2 times in total.
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FAQ: OctaneRender for DAZ Studio - FAQ link collection
FAQ: OctaneRender for DAZ Studio - FAQ link collection
They are set to Unlisted, but you can still watch them all via [url]docs.otoy.com[/url]. I will ask Otoy to set them to public.It appears ALL OctaneRender for Daz Studio videos are set to "private"
Paul
Win7/Win10/Mavericks/Mint 17 - GTX550Ti/GT640M
Octane Plugin Support : Poser, ArchiCAD, Revit, Inventor, AutoCAD, Rhino, Modo, Nuke
Pls read before submitting a support question
Octane Plugin Support : Poser, ArchiCAD, Revit, Inventor, AutoCAD, Rhino, Modo, Nuke
Pls read before submitting a support question
TrakeM - there is also a huge amount of info and tutorials on the plugin in linvanchene's info thread at viewtopic.php?f=44&t=54999
Paul
Paul
Win7/Win10/Mavericks/Mint 17 - GTX550Ti/GT640M
Octane Plugin Support : Poser, ArchiCAD, Revit, Inventor, AutoCAD, Rhino, Modo, Nuke
Pls read before submitting a support question
Octane Plugin Support : Poser, ArchiCAD, Revit, Inventor, AutoCAD, Rhino, Modo, Nuke
Pls read before submitting a support question