OctaneRender® 1.024 beta 2.48b TEST (lin/win) [OBSOLETE]

[Refracty]

i think the goal is not to reproduce the real cameras ( with all his optical constraints-> i do 'real' photographs for my job...) but just to define right parameters without confusion but flexibility:

I agree, I would also not like to have a solution that is constraining too much.
A bit of flexibility in CG is a must.

There are many factors that affect depth of field. The most important are the focal length, the distance of the subject and the camera's aperture setting.

The focal length has nothing to do with the strength of the depth of field effect. But the distance to the subject and the camera aperture have.

[ROUBAL]

vipvip wrote:
i think the goal is not to reproduce the real cameras ( with all his optical constraints-> i do 'real' photographs for my job...) but just to define right parameters without confusion but flexibility:

Refracty wrote:I agree, I would also not like to have a solution that is constraining too much.
A bit of flexibility in CG is a must.

I agree too. We need to get all possible effects including photo realistic results, but there is no need to have tools behaving exactly like a photo camera.

@ Abstrax and OctaneFX : I did my test about materials picker delay using Pathtracing (I forgot to tell), and yes, I used high resolution.

[vipvip]

just a more detailed and cleaner quick-illustrator sheme of what i want to explain: as you know, it's just a suggestion...

[Elvissuperstar007]

portal work? with him even worse

[Daniel79]

The focal length has nothing to do with the strength of the depth of field effect.

This is false....The most important are the focal length, the distance of the subject and the camera's aperture setting.
Holding fixed the other elements(the distance of the subject and the camera's aperture), the depth of field is also reduced increasing the focal length!

[Hawker]

@vipvip.

Such a system would be not physically correct.

plus you can ajuste the lengh of a depht blur with the f factor (aperture) and ajusting speed or sensitibility.

and why do you want that in the render engine depth passes anc compositing are here for that... (when depth pass is available by the way???)

[vipvip]

to daniel 79:
you're right but to come back to octane, when you decrease the aperture value, it increase the bluriness (= dof: that's the case actualy in octane ) BUT it should increase to the exposition in the scene ( that's not the case ).Idem, if you compare octane with the 'real' world: when you increase the FOV value, the it shoud increase the dof-background bluriness ( that's not the case actualy in octane ). That's the beginning of a never-end discussion between octane and real photograph...
So, what's important?..: only the picture you make ( and the more you have precise and clear controls, the more it should fit to your wish)

to hawker:
yes it's not 'physically" correct, but octane( and all) renderer are not 100% physically corrects too( even if they simulate many parameters very well...)...
but i think it shoud be possible, and very great for some composition ( i agree with your post-pro consideration but - perhaps i'm wrong - you can't adjust so closely such parameters with only zdepth infos ( do you ?) and i prefer to have the most closest finished result when rendering, it's more 'fluid' yo obtain the result you want)
My only preoccupation is to have the more flexibility possible...
and as you say, we don't speak about the shutter angle for motion blur, coming next ...

[Refracty]

The focal length has nothing to do with the strength of the depth of field effect.

This is false....The most important are the focal length, the distance of the subject and the camera's aperture setting.
Holding fixed the other elements(the distance of the subject and the camera's aperture), the depth of field is also reduced increasing the focal length!

Hi Daniel79,
we are getting into a photography issue here. Octane does not care .
No, the focal lenght has really nothing to do with the 'strength' of depth of field effect.
I don't know why so many think that. I assume because the longer lens will bring the background apparently closer to the subject and thus the out of focus background will be emphasised. But you have to compare the same subject crops!
You can try it out or ask google if you don't believe me.
The strength is only determined by the aperture (Lens opening), distance from camera to the subject and format size.
There are many sources about that mysteria:

http://www.photokaboom.com/photography/ ... length.htm
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/dof2.shtml
http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-for ... stery.html

Cheers
Refracty

[Refracty]

I think the reason because we see this differently is that I am comparing the same crop and you the total image. So this might be really a discussion based on the difference in the point of view
But I know what you mean.

[jamnique]

I am against making DOF work mandatory like in Maxwell, because it is inconvenient IMO. Want to change DOF? Change f-stop ... and go back to rework tonemapping you liked because it changed the brightness. Want to change apperture, shutter or f-stop for other reasons? Oops, it screwed DOF you liked. And not to forget that shutter changes the way DOF looks AND motion blur works (sorry if i am utterly wrong about some of theses things. That's how i remember it, your user experience might vary)

I'm not bashing Maxwell here, or anyone who wants this functionality. I liked Maxwell. But... sticking strictly to simulating you deprive yourself of the little bit of computer magic you now have, and real photographers would kill for (maybe not for this one, but i know for sure they would kill for lights that don't cast shadows for example).

I would like Octane to keep the healthy proportion between simulating and having a very fluid, result oriented workflow, because it lets you work instead of fighting with bi-directional setting relations.

The only way i see this DOF dependence could work conveniently is introducing priority modes, just like in a real camera. You change the F.Stop - iso compensates.