Fantastic product at fantastic price! Thank you very much. I'm just waiting the morning to reactivate my paypal account. Count me in as one more brazilian to validate your price policy and business direction. Just for still images I couldn't pay more.
I'm getting good performance even on a 9600M GT. But I'm wondering/wishing, if it would be possible to implement a feature to bake the lighting to texture, and maybe even face normal reflection? That would be a great first for an unbiased renderer (as far as I know).
I know it's already almost realtime with the proper hardware and limited scene, but there are still market uses for simpler prelighted realtime walkthroughs with some custom programming.
By the way, 3dconnexion's navigators support would also be delightfull to work around camera positioning difficulties. They can be read as a six axis joystick, I believe it would be cheap to implement this and maybe exposition on their support list could pay for itself.
Please excuse me for being so enthusiastic even without properly using it yet. I'm usually nothing like that, but I got really impressed. Best wishes.
Bake to texture
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ivankio
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- I felt like sharing some screens I got trying the demo. I know it shows no artistic work and "room for improvement" would be a polite form to talk about it. But it's my first time handling an unbiased renderer, and I felt like a child.
we have a 3d connexion and are implementing support for it (it's on our short-term list)
if you get a decent system you can do interactive walkthroughs with octane as is.
baking really is'nt an option as you can only bake diffuse, not specular etc...
that's why there's no unbiased renderers that bake textures.
Radiance
if you get a decent system you can do interactive walkthroughs with octane as is.
baking really is'nt an option as you can only bake diffuse, not specular etc...
that's why there's no unbiased renderers that bake textures.
Radiance
Win 7 x64 & ubuntu | 2x GTX480 | Quad 2.66GHz | 8GB
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ivankio
I'm glad to hear about planned space navigator support.
When you say that it's not an option for unbiased renderers, it means that it's a process technically incompatible, or that there is no point in doing it? In the later case I would like to insist on some points about the diffuse light baking feature.
As I said, I am aware that with propper hardware and a generously limited scene Octane is very capable of interactive frame rates. But there is more to add.
For once, there is more possibilities to interact with the computer than fly by any scenery. Interfaces, spreadsheets, animations, transitions... These data can't be crafted to work in the Octane viewport yet. I use Quest3D for many stuff.
For other appeal, here in Brazil computer hardware are priced often between 200% and 500% american/european/japanese prices, and add to that a weaker economy. While in USA a GTX480 is already called "enthusiastic's hardware" and the price is balanced with value, in some places it will be a luxury item in for the small or medium business.
I was not complaining about that situation, I was just introducing the argument that some old fashioned optimizations to run on "consumer" hardware will still be usefull for a while. I'm guessing that even on lands of price/value balance, diffuse lighting with some more shading is good enough for some applications. For years specular and reflections were grossly approximated and backgrounds painted on cubemaps. I believe they will continue yet for some time on real time CG.
And talking about physical locations, a last appeal in favor of the light baking feature, while octane vieport is great for an architect or designer at his office dealing with his client, there are marketing uses that are planned to spread - several stations, domestic viewing or mobile. I think it could be argued that there are new things like Reality Server, but they are not targeted for the regular designer as Octane.
I hope I didn't sound too preachy or naive. I tried to be negative about accurate luminance baking but I still couldn't think it is such a bad idea. Maybe it could even be marketed as a plugin for Octane. MR is so consuming when it comes to bring sun light to corridors. If Octane could do it, it would do wonders to my CG marketing business, for instance.
When you say that it's not an option for unbiased renderers, it means that it's a process technically incompatible, or that there is no point in doing it? In the later case I would like to insist on some points about the diffuse light baking feature.
As I said, I am aware that with propper hardware and a generously limited scene Octane is very capable of interactive frame rates. But there is more to add.
For once, there is more possibilities to interact with the computer than fly by any scenery. Interfaces, spreadsheets, animations, transitions... These data can't be crafted to work in the Octane viewport yet. I use Quest3D for many stuff.
For other appeal, here in Brazil computer hardware are priced often between 200% and 500% american/european/japanese prices, and add to that a weaker economy. While in USA a GTX480 is already called "enthusiastic's hardware" and the price is balanced with value, in some places it will be a luxury item in for the small or medium business.
I was not complaining about that situation, I was just introducing the argument that some old fashioned optimizations to run on "consumer" hardware will still be usefull for a while. I'm guessing that even on lands of price/value balance, diffuse lighting with some more shading is good enough for some applications. For years specular and reflections were grossly approximated and backgrounds painted on cubemaps. I believe they will continue yet for some time on real time CG.
And talking about physical locations, a last appeal in favor of the light baking feature, while octane vieport is great for an architect or designer at his office dealing with his client, there are marketing uses that are planned to spread - several stations, domestic viewing or mobile. I think it could be argued that there are new things like Reality Server, but they are not targeted for the regular designer as Octane.
I hope I didn't sound too preachy or naive. I tried to be negative about accurate luminance baking but I still couldn't think it is such a bad idea. Maybe it could even be marketed as a plugin for Octane. MR is so consuming when it comes to bring sun light to corridors. If Octane could do it, it would do wonders to my CG marketing business, for instance.
Hi,
Well, we've got 99% of our users in dire need of a lot of features, like MLT, glossy materials, SSS, etc...
We can't just drop everything and implement a quite complex feature that would take weeks to implement just for 0.01% of our userbase.
i hope you understand.
btw, aren't there any existing tools available that do what you need ?
Radiance
Well, we've got 99% of our users in dire need of a lot of features, like MLT, glossy materials, SSS, etc...
We can't just drop everything and implement a quite complex feature that would take weeks to implement just for 0.01% of our userbase.
i hope you understand.
btw, aren't there any existing tools available that do what you need ?
Radiance
Win 7 x64 & ubuntu | 2x GTX480 | Quad 2.66GHz | 8GB
I'm sorry but I'm having real trouble finding a way to do interactive walkthoughs of my models, it doesn't have a look-around shortcut or option (it rotates around something in front) and the zoom only works logarithmically to the rotation center but if that's before the point you need to reach it's very hard to reach it (turning, paning, retrying, etc.)if you get a decent system you can do interactive walkthroughs with octane as is.
It would be easier to be able to have a flythrough mode but the speed would be an issue because you would need to set it in very small increments. 3d connexion support is good news because if an easy way of using it with mouse and keyboard isn't coming soon I'll buy one. (I know it's not easy to do it with mouse/keys and be able to finetune it to the required level). Exporting a camera angle tomorrow with the 2.2 RC would fix part of the problem in the modeling software but still..
we're adding a first person / WASD game style camera in 2.3.vimaxus wrote:I'm sorry but I'm having real trouble finding a way to do interactive walkthoughs of my models, it doesn't have a look-around shortcut or option (it rotates around something in front) and the zoom only works logarithmically to the rotation center but if that's before the point you need to reach it's very hard to reach it (turning, paning, retrying, etc.)if you get a decent system you can do interactive walkthroughs with octane as is.
It would be easier to be able to have a flythrough mode but the speed would be an issue because you would need to set it in very small increments. 3d connexion support is good news because if an easy way of using it with mouse and keyboard isn't coming soon I'll buy one. (I know it's not easy to do it with mouse/keys and be able to finetune it to the required level). Exporting a camera angle tomorrow with the 2.2 RC would fix part of the problem in the modeling software but still..
Radiance
Win 7 x64 & ubuntu | 2x GTX480 | Quad 2.66GHz | 8GB
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ivankio
I understand, of course. I never wanted you to focus on 0.01% of your userbase. I didn't mean to sound egocentric or demanding, I exposed my case just for the record and aware that it is just a sample of your users, in the possibility that there could be more people interested on this. I can not and would not claim to know the global market tendencies and had not such presumptions. I trust your market visions, priority decisions and planning as you came out with a great product already in beta. Please escuse some misunderstanding and annoyance as english is not my native language.
Regarding baking in other packages, I don't know of any product that do this mix of unbiased rendering, baking do texture and quick preview. If you do, please share. I know some renderers that do one or another. I use mentalray and it is a time consuming process because the biased FG is too loose with precision for decent rendering times, even on a small farm, additionally portal lights and other workarounds are time consuming processes. And there is much guessing involved. That's why I wondered if Octane planed to do it.
To make it crystal clear, I've never even suggested that Octane is below any standard. To my knowledge your product is the best reality to the moment. The closest ones that I acknowledged, iRay and vRay-RT, I've seen only working in theory and videos of optimal scenes (no texture, or single object outdoor).
Regarding baking in other packages, I don't know of any product that do this mix of unbiased rendering, baking do texture and quick preview. If you do, please share. I know some renderers that do one or another. I use mentalray and it is a time consuming process because the biased FG is too loose with precision for decent rendering times, even on a small farm, additionally portal lights and other workarounds are time consuming processes. And there is much guessing involved. That's why I wondered if Octane planed to do it.
To make it crystal clear, I've never even suggested that Octane is below any standard. To my knowledge your product is the best reality to the moment. The closest ones that I acknowledged, iRay and vRay-RT, I've seen only working in theory and videos of optimal scenes (no texture, or single object outdoor).
since you can only back diffuse, it really does'nt make sense to use an unbiased renderer for lightmapping...ivankio wrote:I understand, of course. I never wanted you to focus on 0.01% of your userbase. I didn't mean to sound egocentric or demanding, I exposed my case just for the record and aware that it is just a sample of your users, in the possibility that there could be more people interested on this. I can not and would not claim to know the global market tendencies and had not such presumptions. I trust your market visions, priority decisions and planning as you came out with a great product already in beta. Please escuse some misunderstanding and annoyance as english is not my native language.
Regarding baking in other packages, I don't know of any product that do this mix of unbiased rendering, baking do texture and quick preview. If you do, please share. I know some renderers that do one or another. I use mentalray and it is a time consuming process because the biased FG is too loose with precision for decent rendering times, even on a small farm, additionally portal lights and other workarounds are time consuming processes. And there is much guessing involved. That's why I wondered if Octane planed to do it.
To make it crystal clear, I've never even suggested that Octane is below any standard. To my knowledge your product is the best reality to the moment. The closest ones that I acknowledged, iRay and vRay-RT, I've seen only working in theory and videos of optimal scenes (no texture, or single object outdoor).
just use a lightmapper with radiosity
Radiance
Win 7 x64 & ubuntu | 2x GTX480 | Quad 2.66GHz | 8GB
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ivankio
I didn't want to take your programming time with a dead issueradiance wrote:since you can only back diffuse, it really does'nt make sense to use an unbiased renderer for lightmapping...ivankio wrote:... I use mentalray and it is a time consuming process because the biased FG is too loose with precision for decent rendering times, even on a small farm, additionally portal lights and other workarounds are time consuming processes. And there is much guessing involved. ...
just use a lightmapper with radiosity
Radiance
, but I have to be missing something and I would be glad if you could clear something for me:Mental ray and vray are examples of what you called lightmappers capable of radiosity, right? I did use the first for the last 4-5 years, but the "clay" radiosity result from pathtracing with Octane (which would be grossly the diffuse component, right?) is considerably faster on processing, much more accurate and less time consuming without all the hassle of working around the artifacts biased renderers always introduce in trade of production rendering time, specially indoors lit by daylight. And of course you know it all.
I agree that quality outdoor lightmappings are produced easily on many renderers, but indoors are really troublesome to get daylight radiosity baked. The brute force methods for those CPU renderers are prohibitive, while the approximations produce much blur or speckles. Unless I'm not aware of a better package/technique other than vray's irradiance or mray's FG to bake radiosity, I still think that it at least makes sense (even if not profitable for refractive Software) to wish that an unbiased GPU-based renderer could bake light to texture.
Am I missing a technique or software?
i don't know much about lightmapping software options...ivankio wrote:I didn't want to take your programming time with a dead issueradiance wrote:since you can only back diffuse, it really does'nt make sense to use an unbiased renderer for lightmapping...ivankio wrote:... I use mentalray and it is a time consuming process because the biased FG is too loose with precision for decent rendering times, even on a small farm, additionally portal lights and other workarounds are time consuming processes. And there is much guessing involved. ...
just use a lightmapper with radiosity
Radiance
Mental ray and vray are examples of what you called lightmappers capable of radiosity, right? I did use the first for the last 4-5 years, but the "clay" radiosity result from pathtracing with Octane (which would be grossly the diffuse component, right?) is considerably faster on processing, much more accurate and less time consuming without all the hassle of working around the artifacts biased renderers always introduce in trade of production rendering time, specially indoors lit by daylight. And of course you know it all.
I agree that quality outdoor lightmappings are produced easily on many renderers, but indoors are really troublesome to get daylight radiosity baked. The brute force methods for those CPU renderers are prohibitive, while the approximations produce much blur or speckles. Unless I'm not aware of a better package/technique other than vray's irradiance or mray's FG to bake radiosity, I still think that it at least makes sense (even if not profitable for refractive Software) to wish that an unbiased GPU-based renderer could bake light to texture.
Am I missing a technique or software?
maybe in the future we will implement baking, but we've a large list of serious things to implement first to satisfy our primary users/market: unbiased image rendering...
Radiance
Win 7 x64 & ubuntu | 2x GTX480 | Quad 2.66GHz | 8GB