2.25 bugs / needed features

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2.25 bugs / needed features

Postby kavorka » Fri Apr 15, 2016 4:52 pm

kavorka Fri Apr 15, 2016 4:52 pm
We haven't messed around with 3.0, but I wanted to bring some things up before everything gets lost with the official launch of 3.0. If any of these have been addressed already, let me know.

1. After running a batch script, you cannot do anything in the scene without reloading it. If you click on a render target, nothing happens. Restarting the render also does nothing.

2. We still get a random crash when saving an image (we save to a network drive, I don't know if that is important). We haven't seen anything consistent before it happens and it happens all 4 different computers that have different hardware.

3. In Clay mode, is there a way to have light come through glass?
4. Similar tot he above, but if we do an AO pass, it makes glass picture frames black. Is there a way to ignore glass?

5. If you go to File -> Save As Default, would it be possible to add a confirmation dialogue box? It's embarrassing how often we hit that when we want to save and end up replacing our default with a complex scene.

6. For shadow passes, it currently cuts out the object. This can create some problems when compositing because it has a small gap between the object and the shadow (this is more noticeable on lower res images). I attached an image that shows my work around. I separate the object and the floor into 2 objs and turn the camera visibility off on the chair. This way, when I place the object on top of my shadow pass in Photoshop, it works perfectly. This works but it creates more setup and you need to render twice (the chair is no longer visible on the beauty pass). I understand that the current way is how you would want it in some (maybe most) instances, but is it possible to add a checkbox to create it like my attached image?

7. Cleaner nodes. It would be great if there was a connection node.
Essentially, If I have 40 render targets with different objs and all of them have the same material, I want to be able to change the material once and have it change it for everything. Currently the way to do it has a connection line from one macro to everything and it gets messy (and sometimes hard to select things because lines are covering it). It would be great if there was something similar to the input/output nodes for macros that allowed you to plug an input in and assign an ID to it, then plug your material into a node with a corresponding ID and have them connected without at line to each. This would make my scenes SOO much cleaner (especially when I connect kernels, cameras etc to several nodes so I can change them all at once). I attached an image of a scene that isnt that bad, but could really benifit from this feature.
Attachments
Nodes.jpg
Shadows.jpg
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Re: 2.25 bugs / needed features

Postby gah5118 » Fri Apr 15, 2016 7:12 pm

gah5118 Fri Apr 15, 2016 7:12 pm
in addition to what you are requesting.... it would be great if claymode was an optional pass. I have found uses with clay mode over AO sometimes for different projects, but always have to manually kick it out since it can't be hooked into a render target (as far as i know.)
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Re: 2.25 bugs / needed features

Postby gah5118 » Fri Apr 15, 2016 7:15 pm

gah5118 Fri Apr 15, 2016 7:15 pm
check out my idea regarding the wire mess

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=53572

in sort, a way to hide all of the wires via hotkey as well as isolating wires for selected macros
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Re: 2.25 bugs / needed features

Postby kavorka » Fri Apr 15, 2016 8:07 pm

kavorka Fri Apr 15, 2016 8:07 pm
On that note, it would be great if you could expand/contract the nodes of a material (similar to how the macros work).

For instance, you could click a button and it would expand the separate nodes for diffuse, reflection, bump, roughness, etc. then you could click a button and it would re-embed them into the node.
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Re: 2.25 bugs / needed features

Postby gah5118 » Fri Apr 15, 2016 9:11 pm

gah5118 Fri Apr 15, 2016 9:11 pm
that would be pretty sweet.
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Re: 2.25 bugs / needed features

Postby Goldorak » Sat Apr 16, 2016 12:22 am

Goldorak Sat Apr 16, 2016 12:22 am
kavorka wrote:We haven't messed around with 3.0, but I wanted to bring some things up before everything gets lost with the official launch of 3.0. If any of these have been addressed already, let me know.

1. After running a batch script, you cannot do anything in the scene without reloading it. If you click on a render target, nothing happens. Restarting the render also does nothing.

2. We still get a random crash when saving an image (we save to a network drive, I don't know if that is important). We haven't seen anything consistent before it happens and it happens all 4 different computers that have different hardware.

3. In Clay mode, is there a way to have light come through glass?
4. Similar tot he above, but if we do an AO pass, it makes glass picture frames black. Is there a way to ignore glass?

5. If you go to File -> Save As Default, would it be possible to add a confirmation dialogue box? It's embarrassing how often we hit that when we want to save and end up replacing our default with a complex scene.

6. For shadow passes, it currently cuts out the object. This can create some problems when compositing because it has a small gap between the object and the shadow (this is more noticeable on lower res images). I attached an image that shows my work around. I separate the object and the floor into 2 objs and turn the camera visibility off on the chair. This way, when I place the object on top of my shadow pass in Photoshop, it works perfectly. This works but it creates more setup and you need to render twice (the chair is no longer visible on the beauty pass). I understand that the current way is how you would want it in some (maybe most) instances, but is it possible to add a checkbox to create it like my attached image?

7. Cleaner nodes. It would be great if there was a connection node.
Essentially, If I have 40 render targets with different objs and all of them have the same material, I want to be able to change the material once and have it change it for everything. Currently the way to do it has a connection line from one macro to everything and it gets messy (and sometimes hard to select things because lines are covering it). It would be great if there was something similar to the input/output nodes for macros that allowed you to plug an input in and assign an ID to it, then plug your material into a node with a corresponding ID and have them connected without at line to each. This would make my scenes SOO much cleaner (especially when I connect kernels, cameras etc to several nodes so I can change them all at once). I attached an image of a scene that isnt that bad, but could really benifit from this feature.


About (6) above - this is something I have been looking for too, at least through the render layer node. It has taken some work to implement correctly and it is really a V3 feature at this point. You further have V3 deep pixel EXR's as one way to solve this problem in Nuke and other DP EXR tools without splitting the render into layers. It might be worth it to improve the OctaneImager system to allow deep pixel EXR layers, but that is TBD.

For (7) we are going to explore some entirely new UX options with OctaneEngine and HTML5

These are all good suggestions. We are just weeks away from V3's release. Anything beyond a bug/crash/stability fix or simple UI adjustment is out of scope for 2.2x at this point.
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Re: 2.25 bugs / needed features

Postby kavorka » Sat Apr 16, 2016 3:46 am

kavorka Sat Apr 16, 2016 3:46 am
Looking forward to V 3 :)
Also looking forward to anything that can help clean up and streamline the node system.

Having octane imager able to Handel better shadow passes sounds good to me, but we don't use nuke, so if that is the only solution, it's back to my work around for now.
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Re: 2.25 bugs / needed features

Postby abstrax » Sun Apr 17, 2016 9:15 pm

abstrax Sun Apr 17, 2016 9:15 pm
kavorka wrote:We haven't messed around with 3.0, but I wanted to bring some things up before everything gets lost with the official launch of 3.0. If any of these have been addressed already, let me know.

1. After running a batch script, you cannot do anything in the scene without reloading it. If you click on a render target, nothing happens. Restarting the render also does nothing.

We can merge a change of v3 into v2 that fixes the issue. The problem is that the scripts render a copy of the scene root node graph, but then doesn't inform the render target that it has been removed.

2. We still get a random crash when saving an image (we save to a network drive, I don't know if that is important). We haven't seen anything consistent before it happens and it happens all 4 different computers that have different hardware.

I couldn't reproduce the issue and don't have an idea where to look. And as far as I know, you are the only who is reporting the issue. We will add more logging to the result saving code in v3, to investigate this issue further.

3. In Clay mode, is there a way to have light come through glass?

We can have a look at it later in the v3 development cycle, but currently that's not supported.

4. Similar tot he above, but if we do an AO pass, it makes glass picture frames black. Is there a way to ignore glass?

We can have a look at it later in the v3 development cycle, but currently that's not supported.

5. If you go to File -> Save As Default, would it be possible to add a confirmation dialogue box? It's embarrassing how often we hit that when we want to save and end up replacing our default with a complex scene.

We will do.

6. For shadow passes, it currently cuts out the object. This can create some problems when compositing because it has a small gap between the object and the shadow (this is more noticeable on lower res images). I attached an image that shows my work around. I separate the object and the floor into 2 objs and turn the camera visibility off on the chair. This way, when I place the object on top of my shadow pass in Photoshop, it works perfectly. This works but it creates more setup and you need to render twice (the chair is no longer visible on the beauty pass). I understand that the current way is how you would want it in some (maybe most) instances, but is it possible to add a checkbox to create it like my attached image?

No, that's not possible, because when a path hits an object on the active render layer, Octane has to decide to either shoot through it or to bounce off of it. When it shoots through it, you can see the shadows behind the object, but the object itself becomes invisible, which is not what you want, because obviously, you want the objects on the active pass to be visible. The path bounces off the object, we can't calculate the shadows behind the object. This is related to viewtopic.php?p=269484#p269484, which we will look into it as part of v3.

7. Cleaner nodes. It would be great if there was a connection node.
Essentially, If I have 40 render targets with different objs and all of them have the same material, I want to be able to change the material once and have it change it for everything. Currently the way to do it has a connection line from one macro to everything and it gets messy (and sometimes hard to select things because lines are covering it). It would be great if there was something similar to the input/output nodes for macros that allowed you to plug an input in and assign an ID to it, then plug your material into a node with a corresponding ID and have them connected without at line to each. This would make my scenes SOO much cleaner (especially when I connect kernels, cameras etc to several nodes so I can change them all at once). I attached an image of a scene that isnt that bad, but could really benifit from this feature.

The problem with that approach is that it will be very hard to figure out what is connected with what after you haven't touched the scene for a while, because these connections are implicit and invisible. What you could do instead is grouping each scene with its objects and render target into a nested node graph (by selecting its nodes and then using "group items") and give each of them a linker node and then connect the material to those linkers:
nested.png
nested.png (8.77 KiB) Viewed 1784 times
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Re: 2.25 bugs / needed features

Postby abstrax » Sun Apr 17, 2016 9:19 pm

abstrax Sun Apr 17, 2016 9:19 pm
gah5118 wrote:in addition to what you are requesting.... it would be great if claymode was an optional pass. I have found uses with clay mode over AO sometimes for different projects, but always have to manually kick it out since it can't be hooked into a render target (as far as i know.)

Not possible, since it behaves totally different to the normal beauty passes.
In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is. - Yogi Berra
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Re: 2.25 bugs / needed features

Postby abstrax » Sun Apr 17, 2016 9:25 pm

abstrax Sun Apr 17, 2016 9:25 pm
gah5118 wrote:check out my idea regarding the wire mess

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=53572

in sort, a way to hide all of the wires via hotkey as well as isolating wires for selected macros

Again, try using nested node graphs. This way you often can clean up things a lot.
In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is. - Yogi Berra
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