Feature requests

[linvanchene]

Updated to provide more specific information.

DAZStudio is a free app. You get what you pay for. If you are wanting to animate Octane parameters in a production environment, so probably need to move to a 3d app which has better support for keyframing properties (like Modo, c4d, 3ds max, Maya).

DAZ Studio may be free but that does not mean that we are not paying DAZ3D to use the software.
Many features of DAZ Studio are provided as paid 3rd party plugins.
In addition DAZ Studio development is cross financed by the products customers purchase.
Some of the more loyal customers may pay 300-700+ each month.
That sums up to several thousand dollars each year.

To be specific I paid to use
http://www.daz3d.com/keymate
http://www.daz3d.com/graphmate
http://www.daz3d.com/animate2
http://www.daz3d.com/look-at-my-hair

- - -

What I can observe on the OR forum is that Modo, c4d, 3ds max, Maya often also do not have the ability "natively" to support some OctaneRender functionality.

But when there are 3rd party plugins like Turbulence, FumeFx, spline based hair solution plugins etc. that do offer a solution it seems custom to find a way to make them work with OctaneRender.

Fact is users of that free app paid exactly the same amount of money to Otoy as all the other users.
Therefore I would also expect the same effort to make things work.

With all the setbacks DAZ Studio users had to endure since 2014 one might actually have thought that Otoy would now double if not triple their efforts to make up for the time lost.

- - -

This sounds to me more like a "design limitation" to me than a "bug". DAZStudio does not seem to natively support plugin properties being animated - so the plugin has it's own keyframe system. You can edit the graph of a property (for example the Kernel->Specular Depth), but you cannot easily identify if a property has keyframes.

Natively? Maybe not. But as I already mentioned the "official" solution to animate with DAZ Studio are the Gofigure plugins animate, keymate, graphmate.


1) Did you contact GoFigure and ask them if they are interested in supporting the OctaneRender plugin?

2) Did you contact DAZ3D and ask them for help, explaining in detail what kind of options they would need to add from their end so the OctaneRender plugin values will show up in the existing DAZ Studio and GoFigure timelines?

I am under the impression that DAZ3D currently is facing similar challenges figuring out how to animate some Iray specific values. So one might think if several smart heads would work together one might be able to find a solution?

Side Note:
Obviously DAZ3D customer support was not able to share details of the cooperation between DAZ3D and t_3.
Nevertheless the impression I got was that DAZ3D would have been willing to lend help and assistance to make the integration of the OctaneRender plugin easier where possible.

It seemed that t_3 may not have asked for help that often.

Currently I do not know if face_off is now doing things differently and actually contacting DAZ3D on a regular basis.

I am under the impression that talking to DAZ3D and Gofigure and communicating them what kind of exact interface options would be needed to bring OctaneRender values to the Gofigure or DAZ Studio timelines may open up some new possibilities.

It would be a shame if some OcDS features are stuck in a half finished state just because of lack of communication.

[face_off]

DAZ Studio may be free but that does not mean that we are not paying DAZ3D to use the software.
DAZ Studio development is cross financed by the products customers purchase.
Some of the more loyal customers may pay 300-700+ each month.
That sums up to several thousand dollars each year.

No, DAZStudio is free. How much you spend on other DAZ products is up to you, but the 3d host app that the Octane plugin runs in is free.

But when there are 3rd party plugins like Turbulence, FumeFx, spline based hair solution plugins etc. that do offer a solution it seems custom to find a way to make them work in OctaneRender.

This is because those host 3d apps expose the API functionality to access these plugin's data. This is not available in DAZStudio - because they push all the normal core features of a high-end 3d modelling/animation package out to plugins - so none of the plugins share info. It is a flawed concept. The high-end 3d apps expose the hair strand vertices in the API. They provide keyframing across all properties for all plugins. They provide an "undo" stack for all properties for all plugins. That does not happen in DAZStudio. I think you need to use some of the high-end 3d apps to see what is really possible.

Fact is we users of that free app paid exactly the same amount of money to Otoy as all the other users.
Therefore I would also expect the same effort to make things work.

Its actually /more/ effort to support advanced features in DAZStudio than the other Octane plugins. I bet the DAZStudio plugin has had more hours put into it than any of the other Octane plugins. I spend more time on the DAZStudio plugin than the other plugins.

Paul

[linvanchene]

This is because those host 3d apps expose the API functionality to access these plugin's data. This is not available in DAZStudio - because they push all the normal core features of a high-end 3d modelling/animation package out to plugins - so none of the plugins share info. It is a flawed concept. The high-end 3d apps expose the hair strand vertices in the API. They provide keyframing across all properties for all plugins. They provide an "undo" stack for all properties for all plugins. That does not happen in DAZStudio.

That is why I suggested that you should talk to DAZ3D and tell them what you would need in detail to support native OctaneRender values in the DAZ Studio timeline.

Any feedback you can give DAZ3D from the perspective of an experienced developer has much more weight than just random speculations of casual users.

- - -

I bet the DAZStudio plugin has had more hours put into it than any of the other Octane plugins. I spend more time on the DAZStudio plugin than the other plugins.

And exactly because of all that time that already has been invested it would make sense to build on all that work that already has been done.

As far as I am aware none of the "high-end" software specialise in organising, searching, installing and updating licensed content.

DAZ Studio could be used by all other OctaneRender customers as a source for licensed content with OctaneRender materials.

- - -

[Hydra]

linvanchene: Dealing with Daz is a deal with the devil, its business model is 'closed'. They were founded on the principle that they wanted to design models and sell them, and it's shown very painfully and clearly over the years. They absolutely want to control and own everything.

If Daz was interested in making customers satisfied they would have worked on more features to reuse textures and UV maps, etc... But reuse is a bad word to company that wants to sell you more models. (Third party vendors are filling that gap, not Daz.) If they wanted happy plugins they'd have better documentation and integration. But they don't, in fact telling people at Daz that their documentation is out of date or poor will be deleted with prejudice.

Vendors who deal with Daz don't have happy stories either. (Octane is not unique.) Paolo at Reality had a hard time getting various Daz features working. At one point a Daz programmer asked to see his source code and help him figure it out. Paolo said no because he was concerned about his IP... Shortly afterwards a new product was introduced at Daz written by that programmer. This one;
http://www.daz3d.com/luxus

At some point our love of affordable models will butt up against our desire for more control and features. I'm kinda there now.

And whatever negative stuff I say... I like Daz. I like using it.

[gaazsi]

request regarding network rendering:

is it maybe possible that the network slaves jump & support the used daz studio instance automatically?

in my case... i let one render keep going... and work on next picture meanwhile with posing and stuff. sometimes even more instances of daz studio are opened. but the network slaves always just stick to one of them, the first one that was opened. so i have to close them all and reopen the actual one again if the render is finished or i dont get the network slaves to do their work on that one its not big deal, just a little timesaver and maybe easy to adjust from your side

[face_off]

is it maybe possible that the network slaves jump & support the used daz studio instance automatically?

I don't think this would be possible. I doubt that the Octane API will cope with multiple versions of DAZStudio running - all with different Network Render settings.

Paul