OctaneRender™ 2.2 for LightWave™ BETA 1

Newtek Lightwave 3D (exporter developed by holocube, Integrated Plugin developed by juanjgon)

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Lewis
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abstrax wrote: "Keep environment" was always broken, because you can't use a simple alpha channel to cut out the environment from a normal render with environment. The border pixels around the cutout will always be a partial mix between environment and foreground which looks like wrong when you compose it onto a different background.
HI Abstrax.

Sorry for delay but i had some jbs to finish and i was back to 2.16. No wi got some free time to test and show you my issue wiht this removeal of "Keep Environment" option. I can't believe I'm the only one renderign 32B files with Environment+Alpha at one go? With this workflow no passes needed and you can always replace BG if you wish since Alpha is embeded in 32Bit TGA. For 2.20 to get Alpha then ther eis no SKY in Backgorund (or IPR), and if oyu want SKY then you get empty (white) Alpha since it's turned off :(.

Also if you render alpha separatel you then don't get that lens flare effect bloom/glare in 2.20 :(.

Here is how i used it in Octane 2.16 and before
https://www.dropbox.com/s/nlnmj7vy10bx1 ... 6.jpg?dl=0

And here is now problem in 2.2.x after removal of that option :(
https://www.dropbox.com/s/9c0ct91f5eapm ... 0.jpg?dl=0

So my quesiton is how to render it now (2.2x--->) same as in 2.16 at one go/file without extra steps/files/passes?

Thanks for your time
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BorisGoreta
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That is correct, I just copied the files that exe installed.
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Mastoy
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juanjgon wrote:This is the link to the .zip archive:
http://render.otoy.com/rcdownloads/Octa ... _win64.zip

But I suppose that after install the Standalone from the .exe file you should have the same files in your Octane directory that you have in the .zip file.

-Juanjo
Thx for the answer ! I did find the files in the standalone directory :)
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Mastoy
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Lewis wrote:
abstrax wrote: "Keep environment" was always broken, because you can't use a simple alpha channel to cut out the environment from a normal render with environment. The border pixels around the cutout will always be a partial mix between environment and foreground which looks like wrong when you compose it onto a different background.
HI Abstrax.

Sorry for delay but i had some jbs to finish and i was back to 2.16. No wi got some free time to test and show you my issue wiht this removeal of "Keep Environment" option. I can't believe I'm the only one renderign 32B files with Environment+Alpha at one go? With this workflow no passes needed and you can always replace BG if you wish since Alpha is embeded in 32Bit TGA. For 2.20 to get Alpha then ther eis no SKY in Backgorund (or IPR), and if oyu want SKY then you get empty (white) Alpha since it's turned off :(.

Also if you render alpha separatel you then don't get that lens flare effect bloom/glare in 2.20 :(.

Here is how i used it in Octane 2.16 and before
https://www.dropbox.com/s/nlnmj7vy10bx1 ... 6.jpg?dl=0

And here is now problem in 2.2.x after removal of that option :(
https://www.dropbox.com/s/9c0ct91f5eapm ... 0.jpg?dl=0

So my quesiton is how to render it now (2.2x--->) same as in 2.16 at one go/file without extra steps/files/passes?

Thanks for your time
I have the same problem. I use RGBA files with the environment all the time.
I do a lot of products animations and I usually send my clients such files, so that they can color-correct either the product, or the background, just by using the alpha embedded.
That was so simple !
CANDITO
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Hi,

to keep on with Lewis post on the "keep environment" issue, i use HDR studio
a lot, and have the same problem, i can't get my full image with the alpha channel
as the background that HDR studio generates disapear when you activate the alpha...

Oliv
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Lewis
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Thank you guys for confirmation, i feel much better now that someone understands how good/important that feature was. Effectively this completely kills the meaning of saving 32bit TGA/PNG/TIFF out of render engine 'coz i can't have alpha an BG visible :(. To mimic 2.16 behavior i need to render scene TWICE. Once for getting BG/SKY/HDRI affected by post processing node and next time to just get Alpha channel :(. Rendering just Environment pass is no good (i tried several times) since you don't get post process effects (bloom...) on it so it's completely dull look :(

OTOY, please bring back "Keep environment" feature.
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Lewis
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abstrax
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Lewis wrote:Thank you guys for confirmation, i feel much better now that someone understands how good/important that feature was. Effectively this completely kills the meaning of saving 32bit TGA/PNG/TIFF out of render engine 'coz i can't have alpha an BG visible :(. To mimic 2.16 behavior i need to render scene TWICE. Once for getting BG/SKY/HDRI affected by post processing node and next time to just get Alpha channel :(. Rendering just Environment pass is no good (i tried several times) since you don't get post process effects (bloom...) on it so it's completely dull look :(

OTOY, please bring back "Keep environment" feature.
So the problem is the missing post-effects of the environment? I think, that can be fixed. Using just an alpha-mask on a normal rendering including the background will cause artifacts on the border when you composite on some other background, rendering the alpha channel useless.
In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is. - Yogi Berra
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Lewis
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abstrax wrote:
Lewis wrote:Thank you guys for confirmation, i feel much better now that someone understands how good/important that feature was. Effectively this completely kills the meaning of saving 32bit TGA/PNG/TIFF out of render engine 'coz i can't have alpha an BG visible :(. To mimic 2.16 behavior i need to render scene TWICE. Once for getting BG/SKY/HDRI affected by post processing node and next time to just get Alpha channel :(. Rendering just Environment pass is no good (i tried several times) since you don't get post process effects (bloom...) on it so it's completely dull look :(

OTOY, please bring back "Keep environment" feature.
So the problem is the missing post-effects of the environment? I think, that can be fixed. Using just an alpha-mask on a normal rendering including the background will cause artifacts on the border when you composite on some other background, rendering the alpha channel useless.
Well that's one of problems but even that would be better than current state. It would still be extra step(s) (to save more formats/images instead single 32Bit TGA/PNG/TIFF file which allow you both options at one go/render to use BG rendered or change your mind and replace it with some other BG/Sky).

I'm aware of renderings problem you are describing with alpha but I find it problematic ONLY if you use DOF and Mblur, but if is crisp still render with no problems (we can use Z-depth pass for post-pocessing DOF also). I almost always use premultiply alpha with 1 pixel de-fringe in PS/AE IF I need to replace BG completely but usually i just overly clouds/gradient sky on to already in camera render so no such problems are visible (at least not to clients ;)). That method worked quite well all those years for me, still using int with native LW render engine + sIBL/sky backgrounds 'coz it's optionally available to "not affect alpha" for any BG/image but still visible in Beauty pass.

- Can't you bring back that function/button and just put disclaimer/info in manual about possible problem (in some situations) when users are using it and that's it ? I see that as win-win situation.
- Or Maybe add feature to Texture Image/SYK environemnt called "exclude from Alpha" ?

Thanks for participating.
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Lewis
http://www.ram-studio.hr
Skype - lewis3d
ICQ - 7128177

WS AMD TRPro 3955WX, 256GB RAM, Win10, 2 * RTX 4090, 1 * RTX 3090
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Mastoy
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abstrax wrote:So the problem is the missing post-effects of the environment? I think, that can be fixed. Using just an alpha-mask on a normal rendering including the background will cause artifacts on the border when you composite on some other background, rendering the alpha channel useless.
As Lewis said, I too find the alpha channel useful for many more things than just changing the background (especially when there's no MB or DOF) !!
I really would like to see the "Keep environment" come back !
alexos
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+1 on the return of the "keep environment" checkbox; in my case, since I do a lot of photo-matching, it's an extremely useful feature. As Lewis says, I too must often render the same image twice (although for the alpha I generally use the infochannel kernel, which is admittedly pretty damn fast)

Best,

ADP.
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