FOREGROUND FOG DENSITY Tweet

[itsallgoode9]

It is true that there is solutions, as you have kindly mentioned,
Yet the default one that Otoy has provided is a long been criticized as hard to use, but they just not to change...
I think it is a big problem that Otoy's not listioning to user's voice, this is one example from so many of them.

As a business, Otoy, like any other, has to prioritize effort. You can be sure they know there are features that could use some work, including this one, but others have higher priority. While this may be an important issue to you, it may not be a problem for others who have found solutions that work for them.

Any tool of this complexity is going to have problems and weaknesses. This has always been true. Exactly what those weaknesses will be shifts over time, but they never go away. That is the price of rapid progress. If you want to stick with Alias Poweranimator's tool set and keep refining them for 15 or 20 years, you might get close to perfection, but then you'd be working with 30 year old technology and at a significant disadvantage in most segments of the industry.

There's nothing wrong what that, of course. I'm a lifelong woodworker, and I tend to used chisels and hand planes and saws and cabinet scrapers, tools that have been incrementally refined over literally thousands of years. I do have modern machinery, too, but I generally choose to use the more elegant tools. I don't make my living as a furniture maker, however. If I did, I'd have to accomodate the tear-out of the mortising machine, the snype of the thickness planer, the occasional burning of the table saw, none of which are problems with my hand tools, but it would be easier to turn a profit.

I'm really pleased to see that they prioritized efforts to make Sculptron over core feature fixes/missing feature additions
By your condescending argument, we never should've moved past Octane V1

[coilbook]

Otoy, you promised procedurally scattered clouds. I am surprised you don’t want to invest into accurate rendering of atmospherics like fog, clouds, rain, etc like e-on does. So far we got a sphere that changes size and transparency and you call it density and medium radius. Even old scanline max had better fog.

[frankmci]

I'm really pleased to see that they prioritized efforts to make Sculptron over core feature fixes/missing feature additions
By your condescending argument, we never should've moved past Octane V1

I'm really pleased to see that they prioritized efforts to make Sculptron over core feature fixes/missing feature additions
By your condescending argument, we never should've moved past Octane V1

Sarcastically roll your eyes as hard as you like, that does not change the reality of doing business.

As I said, this particular issue doesn't seem to be a big problem for a lot of people at this time. If it was significant enough that people voted with their wallets, it would most likely have been addressed sooner, but it clearly has not been a high priority. You are free use take your money elsewhere. Unless your problems align with a large enough fraction of the customer base, they are unlikely to be addressed very quickly if ever. These are very complicated tools, and they will never be perfect. Limited resources must be allocated based on imperfect information and best-guess predictions. Life is complicated. It is impossible to please everyone.

That's not condescension, that's just basic facts of trying to stay profitable in a highly competitive, rapidly changing field.

People get very worked up over this stuff, and I had hoped to offer a little perspective, having dealt with these particular issues for several decades. I figured it was likely a fruitless gesture, and that seems to have been a correct assessment in your case. It's certainly good to express your desires as a customer, providing useful feedback for their business decisions, but you reduce your quality of life by getting upset over it.

[coilbook]

Hi Otoy,
Please look at this image from turbosquid rendered with another engine.
As you can see distance is very short between foreground that has 0 fog and background. The only way I can achieve this with octane is to have 1 mile or more distance between background and foreground. We just want more precise control between them

[andrey.krivulya]

+1

[jimho]

I'm really pleased to see that they prioritized efforts to make Sculptron over core feature fixes/missing feature additions
By your condescending argument, we never should've moved past Octane V1

I'm really pleased to see that they prioritized efforts to make Sculptron over core feature fixes/missing feature additions
By your condescending argument, we never should've moved past Octane V1

Sarcastically roll your eyes as hard as you like, that does not change the reality of doing business.

As I said, this particular issue doesn't seem to be a big problem for a lot of people at this time. If it was significant enough that people voted with their wallets, it would most likely have been addressed sooner, but it clearly has not been a high priority. You are free use take your money elsewhere. Unless your problems align with a large enough fraction of the customer base, they are unlikely to be addressed very quickly if ever. These are very complicated tools, and they will never be perfect. Limited resources must be allocated based on imperfect information and best-guess predictions. Life is complicated. It is impossible to please everyone.

That's not condescension, that's just basic facts of trying to stay profitable in a highly competitive, rapidly changing field.

People get very worked up over this stuff, and I had hoped to offer a little perspective, having dealt with these particular issues for several decades. I figured it was likely a fruitless gesture, and that seems to have been a correct assessment in your case. It's certainly good to express your desires as a customer, providing useful feedback for their business decisions, but you reduce your quality of life by getting upset over it.

All users are not comfortable with this issue,it is a big problem.
It is just because not every one speaks out that you think not everyone care about it. if you search the forum you can see how many posts complaining the fog/medium issue over the past years.
this ignorring is losing your users,Otoy！
it is not that difficult, having the time arguing here, it should have been fixed already.

[frankmci]

All users are not comfortable with this issue,it is a big problem.

It is impossible to make all users comfortable, with pretty much any issue. It is a problem, but is it actually as big a problem as it may seem?

It is just because not every one speaks out that you think not everyone care about it. if you search the forum you can see how many posts complaining the fog/medium issue over the past years.

Yes, I'm very aware of the forum discussions about fog over the past few years, and have often been a participant. I try to help out when I can.

this ignorring is losing your users,Otoy！

Yes, it probably is costing a few customers, but I think it's a matter of prioritizing, not ignoring. The question is, "Does not updating the fog system at this time cost Otoy more customers than dedicating limited developer resources toward adding/updating other features gains them?" Resource allocation is a tricky part of running a business, especially one in such rapid flux as 3D rendering. I'm glad I don't have to make those kinds of decisions.

it is not that difficult, having the time arguing here, it should have been fixed already.

You and I actually have no idea how difficult it may or may not be. It may be simple, or it may require fundamental changes that have very far reaching effects, or more likely, it's somewhere in between. My guess is that either A: it's not as easy as it may look from a non-developer's POV, or B: it has a relatively low priority because it doesn't negatively affect a large enough portion of the users to the point they jump ship.

I don't see this as an argument, and I'm sorry you do. I see it as a discussion and a conversation. I'm just trying to perhaps help some folks see things from the business development side of things, when they get frustrated and angry. Life if messy and complicated and far from perfect. No one likes to feel frustrated and angry. (Well, some people do seem to enjoy it, or at least get some gratification from it, but I don't think there's really anything you can do for those sad souls.)

[pegot]

I feel the fog system is not useful in many situations I try to use it in. I have struggled with it and in most cases failed. I do know it is capable of very good results as seen through some forum posts but I just can't ever attain perfectly clear foreground and obscure foggy background. At this point all I really want are some detailed tutorials showing how to do that in Stand Alone and in the Octane Blender Plugin. I have seen some great tuts explaining Octane fog with Cinema 4D but at some point the instructions fail to sync with SA or Octane Blender and I can not achieve the demonstrated effect. I am sure most of this is due to my own inexperience. All I ask is that Otoy put out a comprehensive guide and sample files showing exactly how to get clear foreground and foggy background in SA with an animated scene.

[jimho]

You and I actually have no idea how difficult it may or may not be.

I think it should not be difficult, to explain here:
the problem comes from the asumption of the "fog model"
the current model is like: a VDB sphere arround the camera,the center is at the camera point(viewer point) , the radius etc is about this sphere's size, the rest of the parameters is about the the density etc for the VDB medium.
the result of this "fog model" is pretty not ideal as all are keep complaining.

most of the reason that we need a fog is to help the effect of DOF, the closer object and frontage more clear and stand out.

one possible solution can be: just simply move the sphere center to the target,(or more precisely to say a distance to the cermera point along the direction to the targetpoint) all the descriptions can be kept as it is,

And this should cost almost nothing.
Should this be easy?