Is 'everyting nodes' now in Octane Blender? Tweet

[AlexeyAdamitsky]

Is pushing every settings of Octane integration in Blender into the nodes a new strategy for further releases?

I know it makes for some things but I really dislike that kernel settings are moved to the nodes network. Can you explain the reasoning and how that supposed to improve my experience with Octane?

It's not easy in Blender to switch between windows since it doesn't have tabs. Now I need to juggle a lot of context switching to adjust different settings at different stages of my workflow. It's very flow breaking and adds up on time.

Is kernels move to a separate shader editor a temporary solution or it's going to be like that from now on?

[linograndiotoy]

If you create your Kernels, you can switch among those exactly as you were doing before.

The change has been done to make the addon integration clearer and faster.

[AlexeyAdamitsky]

If you create your Kernels, you can switch among those exactly as you were doing before.

To a point, I agree. Technically you can. But why this has to be done like that in Blender? Why do you need to expose kernel nodes in a separate editor? How does it improve the user experience?

I can give you a number of point how it makes things more complicated:

1. New users now need to understand that you have to go to a separate editor to setup your different Kernels if you need them.
2. Blender has a very hard time dealing with new custom editor types and cases all sorts of issues. Especially when you're working with more than one scene. I've had many issues with the new AOV system because of how custom editors are implemented.
3. It might be a matter of personal taste but to me the implementation in the settings panels looks ugly when you need to reference a kernel nodes setup. I don't think it can be improved at the moment due to how Blender UI works.

Maybe the only possible benefit I can see is that you can create the same or different kernel with different quality settings. But the more polished presets system could be a better solution, I believe.

Why can't you just update the panel layout and reference the kernel nodes without exposing them in the editor? I don't really understand the benefit of this.

P.S. Also I believe the Path Tracing and Photon Tracing kernels could be easily merged. They're practically the same with the benefit of photon tracing when you need it.

[Andreas_Resch]

Maybe a compromise would be to keep the Kernel editor but have all the Kernels set up in advance so you can pick them from the dropdown menu. So the average user never really has to open the editor. If there are reasons to do so, they can though. Overall keep Octane simple and clear definitely should be a target. Entry hurdles are a thing.

[AlexeyAdamitsky]

Octane is a powerful and complex tool but it doesn't mean that you need to make it more complicated to use. Which I feel you definitely do with this new development strategy. In some respect Octane is becoming more “noisy” and complicated to use with a vast of exposed settings which you through at the user which are rarely needed. I think the opposite strategy would be beneficial to the Octane user base.

Another such case is the introduction of Analytic lights. It's a huge deal to have these lights in Octane. But their implementation in Blender is over complicated.



All the possible settings are exposed all at once in the node. But not all the settings (2) are affecting the result based on the chosen (1) light type.

I don't understand why you won't hide this node (1) from the user and just expose the settings in the light object panel(2)? If you do it this way you can expose only the settings that are affecting the chosen light and use the proper light objects for each light type. Right now it's all very thrown in together.

I don't yet see any benefits for this node to be exposed to the user.



One could make a custom solution per light to clean up this mess with node groups (1) and use the light preferences panel to control the light without the need to go into the nodes editor each time. Unfortunately, when groups are used the preferences panel (2) is not exposing the settings properly. It's probably a Blender's bug. But still you can have a nice work flow with lights.

[linograndiotoy]

Maybe a compromise would be to keep the Kernel editor but have all the Kernels set up in advance so you can pick them from the dropdown menu. So the average user never really has to open the editor. If there are reasons to do so, they can though. Overall keep Octane simple and clear definitely should be a target. Entry hurdles are a thing.

Yes, that's the solution. Different selectable Kernels are already present in the Octane Default Startup is used.
For sure we need presets, by the way.

[linograndiotoy]

@AlexeyAdamitsky

Analytic Lights are directly implemented as they are in Standalone right now. This may change in the future, consider this build is still in beta.

All the attributes are available in the Light Preference Panel, no need to access the nodal panel at all (at least in the internal version I'm testing, available soon).

[AlexeyAdamitsky]

All the attributes are available in the Light Preference Panel, no need to access the nodal panel at all (at least in the internal version I'm testing, available soon).

Ok, let's wait and see how this implemented.

Yes, that's the solution. Different selectable Kernels are already present in the Octane Default Startup is used.

I don't agree with this direction. Don't see how it improves my experience. Still haven't heard the reasoning why it has to be like that. Only that it is from now on.

By the way, where would be the best place to participate in the discussion of new features or design changes coming to Octane? I barely use standalone but it deicing decisions affects all the integrations in the end. I'd like to voice my concerns in the right channels where they can be seen.

[linograndiotoy]

I don't agree with this direction. Don't see how it improves my experience. Still haven't heard the reasoning why it has to be like that. Only that it is from now on.

On the "surface" is basically going to work exactly as before, but we'll also have presets we can store and recall. Still, we'll be able to edit Kernels in the relative node editor.

It's definitely an improvement imo.

By the way, where would be the best place to participate in the discussion of new features or design changes coming to Octane? I barely use standalone but it deicing decisions affects all the integrations in the end. I'd like to voice my concerns in the right channels where they can be seen.

I think the General Discussion section could be the right place:

viewforum.php?f=9