OTOY Forums

leblancd wrote:

Goldorak wrote: Yep. i am doing what I can to get regular updates back on track. I will keep you posted.

It has been a week.
How regular are the "regular" updates supposed to happen?

t_3 has stated categorically that he's not providing regular progress updates so I doubt that will change. This thread will fizzle out just like all the others and things will carry on as before unfortunately. Great though many of the Octane features are I think it's only fair that we warn others over at DAZ of the circumstances if they're contemplating buying this plugin.

The message sent on Aug 18 2015 is still in the outbox on Sept 08 2015. The questions are still not answered.

Spectralis wrote:This thread will fizzle out just like all the others and things will carry on as before unfortunately.

I tried to show patience for more than one and a half year so the developers can figure this out and solve this by HELPING EACH OTHER.
There have other users been trying to get the attention of the executives in the past. (compare that twitter post)

So far I did not write an official and legally bending letter because I thought that it would be in everyones best interest if this is solved in house.

Spectralis wrote: Great though many of the Octane features are I think it's only fair that we warn others over at DAZ of the circumstances if they're contemplating buying this plugin.

Maybe some of those magazines writing OctaneRender 3 reviews will have a very close look at what Otoy has been doing in the past years.

A lot of the issues we experience with OcDS are also happening on a more general level when you consider the delays and concept changes with Brigade and the Cloud Edition.


@ Monetary damage

In its current state:

- it is not possible to accept client work with BETA software

this means each month work that could have been accepted has to be declined

- it is not possible to create 3D assets with OctaneRender materials .duf presets for individual surfaces

this means people can not earn money be licensing 3D assets for OctaneRender

There is no point in tossing around numbers. But the monetary damage is real and felt each month.

People invested time and money for OctaneRender.
- time to learn the software
- money for the equipment like workstations and multiple GPU
- money for licensed 3D assets

Some users spend 300-600+ dollars on licensed 3D assets each month.

My idea was that I can use the assets to create at least 2-3 images each week.
I spent thousands of dollars on 3D assets that I never got to use.

Otoy and the plugin developer made a lot of empty promises that mislead people into investing into this technology with the hope of a better future.


@ Reputation Damage:

- Clients do not care why the work cannot be done
Clients expect a YES it is possible and are not looking for partners that say: I can do it MAYBE in a few months IF finally that plugin is production ready.

- Business partners start to loose faith
Business partners are looking for working solutions and not empty promises.

I personally recommended OctaneRender to a lot of people because of all the promises made about CloudRendering and ORBX file interchange between multiple software applications.
Now the situation is:
- Renting GPU for CloudRendering is still in BETA
- announced plugins for photoshop, AfterEffects, Zbrush are not published
- OcDS has not been finally made production ready ONE YEAR after all those promises made in September 2014.

I have to apologize to a lot of people for recommending OctaneRender.
I stopped creating images with OctaneRender because it is simply MISSLEADING to show art if the software is NOT READY.

- - -

Instead of hiring twice the amount of developers who can do the work in half the time OTOY has neglected their responsibility.

Otoy seems to be forgetting that many people have actually worked with CPU solutions that have already figured out all those features that are still missing in OctaneRender.
What customers expected was to get a working solution quickly and not all those threads saying:

"Yes we would like to add that feature but we currently do not have the time."
"This feature will not make it into the current release cycle but may be added at a later time.

Then HIRE STAFF TEMPORARILY until all the projects are back on a reasonable time schedule.

IF one GPU takes two weeks to finish an animation project
TWO GPU will take only one week to finish the project.

therefore
If one developer takes two years to finish a plugin project
TWO developers should be able to finish the project in ONE year.

- - -

On the one hand talking negative about OctaneRender may have exactly the opposite effect of what we want:
This render engine to succeed.

But then maybe companies like Otoy need to learn the lesson that it is NOT acceptable to play around with the future of small studios and freelancers.

I learnt long ago that however you complain, asking nicely or getting angry, makes not one bit of difference. I think a lot of opportunities like the possibility of Octane being integrated into low end software such as DS and Poser may have been squandered due to the unreliability and broken promises. If we don't take OTOY seriously then will anyone else?

Spectralis wrote:I learnt long ago that however you complain, asking nicely or getting angry, makes not one bit of difference. I think a lot of opportunities like the possibility of Octane being integrated into low end software such as DS and Poser may have been squandered due to the unreliability and broken promises. If we don't take OTOY seriously then will anyone else?

Dont' drag Poser into this. Those users seem happy, they have an active dev who makes a handful of other Octane plugins. This is one area Poser users win. DS plugin problem is not theirs.

We are in top of this and will update you all shortly. Thank you for your patience.

larsmidnatt wrote:

Spectralis wrote:I learnt long ago that however you complain, asking nicely or getting angry, makes not one bit of difference. I think a lot of opportunities like the possibility of Octane being integrated into low end software such as DS and Poser may have been squandered due to the unreliability and broken promises. If we don't take OTOY seriously then will anyone else?

Dont' drag Poser into this. Those users seem happy, they have an active dev who makes a handful of other Octane plugins. This is one area Poser users win. DS plugin problem is not theirs.

It's pretty obvious that my post is referring to how the perception of OTOY and in particular the OcDS plugin may have affected confidence in it's products and has absolutely nothing to do with the developer of the Poser plugin. But if you want to misconstrue it just so you can start another war then bring it on!

Spectralis wrote: It's pretty obvious that my post is referring to how the perception of OTOY and in particular the OcDS plugin may have affected confidence in it's products and has absolutely nothing to do with the developer of the Poser plugin. But if you want to misconstrue it just so you can start another war then bring it on!

If it was particular to the OcDS plugin, why bring up poser?

It seems like you are twisting things again. My point was pretty clear. At no point did anyone say anything about your perception on the developer.I mentioned their developer activity, which is a challenge we have here.

Poser plugin isn't in the same boat as the DS plugin. It even has a free trial. (which means it's a a presentable state) Apples and oranges.

I think a lot of opportunities like the possibility of Octane being integrated into low end software such as DS and Poser may have been squandered due to the unreliability and broken promises.

Poser folks seem fine, that is what I said. They get regular updates and brag about their plugin. DS users tend not to.

I understand you are easily agitated but there is no point in wasting energy like this. Not like I'm to blame for the current state of affairs :/

I was responding to linvanchene's comments about OTOY's reputation if you actually bothered to read the thread. I didn't mention the Poser developer at all. You did. I note that you have nothing to say about the criticisms of others on here but are eager to misconstrue what I post. You seem to have a bee in your bonnet about me and I'm very happy to challenge that every time you post such nonsense. You've crossed this line before so don't play the innocent or blame me for responding to your troll like behaviour.

I already stated I never stated you said anything about the poser dev, you stated I did but never provided evidence. Next time at least provide evidence.

You've mentioned poser multiple times in your posts, I just quoted you. Not just this thread but others, how Otoy missed poser somehow. So you could see you are the one that brought up poser

Third quote is a charm. Emphasis mine, but it demonstrates the point.

Spectralis wrote:I learnt long ago that however you complain, asking nicely or getting angry, makes not one bit of difference. I think a lot of opportunities like the possibility of Octane being integrated into low end software such as DS and Poser may have been squandered due to the unreliability and broken promises. If we don't take OTOY seriously then will anyone else?

This is what I just said.

My point was pretty clear. At no point did anyone say anything about your perception on the developer.I mentioned their developer activity, which is a challenge we have here.

Octane users that use Daz or Poser aren't in the same boat. I don't think a lot of people believe they are.

Not sure how that crosses the line :/

I'm not going to waste my time pouring over your latest attempt at backtracking. You're full of it.