Practical math

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Practical math

Postby ristoraven » Sun Aug 30, 2015 5:38 pm

ristoraven Sun Aug 30, 2015 5:38 pm
When the 18k stereo cube animations comes available.

There's 60 frames in one second, so there's 3600 frames in one minute. So, five minutes show would make 18 000 frames. If one frame would be 20 mb, the five minutes show would be 360 GB sized package.

Am I missing something?

Hmm.

I place my bets and keep my fingers & toes crossed on lightfield baking.
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Re: Practical math

Postby Goldorak » Sun Aug 30, 2015 7:23 pm

Goldorak Sun Aug 30, 2015 7:23 pm
ristoraven wrote:When the 18k stereo cube animations comes available.

There's 60 frames in one second, so there's 3600 frames in one minute. So, five minutes show would make 18 000 frames. If one frame would be 20 mb, the five minutes show would be 360 GB sized package.

Am I missing something?

Hmm.

I place my bets and keep my fingers & toes crossed on lightfield baking.


It is roughly 10x-20x larger than high quality 4K video. We can make it smaller, but right now it is for content that is under a minute realistically. We will allow you to stream these videos on demand with only the fov you see being sent over the stream. In that case, 18k video is still true source you want for this.

Yes light fields would be even better. You can then change IPD and viewport during playback.
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Re: Practical math

Postby ristoraven » Sun Aug 30, 2015 7:57 pm

ristoraven Sun Aug 30, 2015 7:57 pm
But rendering 18 000 18k frames for a five minutes show.. makes me scratch my head. It is kinda huge.

If there's one "master frame" render and then all that what moves in the scene are taken in via alpha channels / render passes, so that I end up rendering only the moving parts, that would make sense. So if there's a flock of birds flying around, I don't render the whole scene 18 000 times, but just the birds and their shadows..
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Re: Practical math

Postby Rikk The Gaijin » Mon Aug 31, 2015 12:41 am

Rikk The Gaijin Mon Aug 31, 2015 12:41 am
ristoraven wrote:But rendering 18 000 18k frames for a five minutes show.. makes me scratch my head. It is kinda huge.

New video format requires more data, it's the natural evolution. It has always been like this.
In the year 2000 the average hard disk size for a PC was 25GB, today is 1TB.
Anyway, I wouldn't consider render a 18K video at 60 fps for now, just keep it at 24 fps or 30 fps.
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Re: Practical math

Postby ristoraven » Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:36 am

ristoraven Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:36 am
That's true Rikk.
I remember being amazed with my first 20 GB hard disk.
Voodoo 2 graphics card + quake2 blew me away. It's not that long ago. I'm not old. :)

So yes, there could be one hour long, 4,2 terabyte streamed virtual reality experiences in the near future. Not an impossible idea by any means.
If the data stays at the server and only FOV is sent.. why not?
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Re: Practical math

Postby Rikk The Gaijin » Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:59 am

Rikk The Gaijin Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:59 am
Even streaming the full data sounds doable for me. I have 1GBit connection here in Japan, and soon there will be available 10Gbit connections. In few years we will have 100GBit connections, so I guess streaming Gigabytes of data in real-time will be totally possible.
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Re: Practical math

Postby ristoraven » Mon Aug 31, 2015 9:22 am

ristoraven Mon Aug 31, 2015 9:22 am
Doable yes, but how soon it will be available to the masses?
In VR markets, the estimates what I have seen, tells that in 2017 VR is already a major player in entertainment biz. 2016 is still for early birds. Combined hardware and software sales will reach 7 billion $ by 2018.

So, If we assume Octane is right there on the top providing the highest quality from the get go, Otoy still needs to take into account the bottlenecks what "ordinary" consumers have with their bandwidth & all.. That is about 10 - 100 mb connection at best.

But, Otoy seems to be very confident that they are doing this as it should be done, so, I have no serious worries about all this.
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Re: Practical math

Postby Rikk The Gaijin » Tue Sep 01, 2015 12:01 am

Rikk The Gaijin Tue Sep 01, 2015 12:01 am
ristoraven wrote:In VR markets, the estimates what I have seen, tells that in 2017 VR is already a major player in entertainment biz. 2016 is still for early birds. Combined hardware and software sales will reach 7 billion $ by 2018.

2017 seems too early for me to be a major player in entertainment... Billions of people never even tried a VR headset yet... Also, a lot of people are skeptical, and others are just not interested in it.
Like my wife, she tried the Gear VR for the very first time (very first VR headset in her life) with my Metaverse scene, and she was totally unimpressed by it. Se was like "mm, ok it's kinda cool." Then she tried the DK2 with a couple of demos, and she was like "why is everything so blurry, I can't see, it feels like I'm looking underwater"... Soooooo yeah.. :?
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Re: Practical math

Postby ristoraven » Tue Sep 01, 2015 8:30 am

ristoraven Tue Sep 01, 2015 8:30 am
My ex wife is pretty much the same. :)

Altough her ipd is so small that she just can't feel comfortable with HMD.

Fortunately women are not the majority. But I am still pretty sure, that if there's Johnny Depp or Harrison Ford in the scene, they will suddenly find HMDs quite appealing. I think the crucial thing for the success of VR is high quality content, and that means high quality story telling in new environment.

If real actors could be merged seamlessly into Octane rendered scenes, that would be the Holy Grail in my opinion. LightStage for example is too heavy solution. Even for a bigger budget production. It needs to be, lets say, four cameras and depth sensors that cross capture the actors in the middle. Something simple. High speed laser scans, quantum mechanics.. I don't know. But if Oculus has two billion dollars budget, I think it is fair to expect something new. Oculus could send a probe to mars and back with that money. .
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