Serious scale issue

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Serious scale issue

Postby gabrielefx » Tue Jun 16, 2015 1:24 pm

gabrielefx Tue Jun 16, 2015 1:24 pm
Hi all,
I showed the Gear VR to some clients of mine. They are designers, architects, photographers.
Generally I design my 3d scenes in meters and I used a 0,007 ipd. It doesn't change if the ipd is 0,02, we get more 3d depth.
In all tests the people that experienced the VR vision said: I'm watching like a fly. The scale isn't correct.
All objects seems to be enormous.
I have had the same impression watching the Orbx demos that I deleted from the Gear VR because they were out of scale, specially the Karba scene with the truck.

I think that the perspective fov and the GearVR don't match.
I think you have to work with Oculus to understand how to create the right cubic perspective.

regards.
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Re: Serious scale issue

Postby glimpse » Tue Jun 16, 2015 2:40 pm

glimpse Tue Jun 16, 2015 2:40 pm
Have to agree on this - have the same feeling & would love to know how to tweak this out to get closer to reality.
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Re: Serious scale issue

Postby Goldorak » Tue Jun 16, 2015 4:23 pm

Goldorak Tue Jun 16, 2015 4:23 pm
The ORBX samples were in some cases deliberately scaled to show off the depth or make the scene look like a tilt shift camera. Normal 1 meter world scale and default 65 mm ipd should like fine - see the BLR renders for examples of real world unit scales applied correctly.

Also - according to Carmack - 1-1.5 meters ( 10-20x ipd) is very comfortable stereo for most casual viewing experiences.
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Re: Serious scale issue

Postby ristoraven » Tue Jun 16, 2015 5:39 pm

ristoraven Tue Jun 16, 2015 5:39 pm
In VR the scales of stuff needs to be accurate in cm level. If they are off by something like 20 centimeters, it is very noticeable and looks incorrect.

If you want to use 65 mm IPD I recommend creating a mock up human figure, that is real life average human size, about 178 cm, then modelling everything so that this figure is next to the model you are creating.

In my case, I want to use 95 mm IPD, because it gives the best stereo effect imo ( higher than that may cause eye strain to some people), I scaled this mock up figure to be 2 meters tall. Higher IPD compensates this slighlty exaggerated height..
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Re: Serious scale issue

Postby gabrielefx » Tue Jun 16, 2015 6:37 pm

gabrielefx Tue Jun 16, 2015 6:37 pm
I don't understand.

I created a room 4x4 meters and I positioned the cubic camera in the center at 1,6 meters high.
My scene unit is in meters.
The ipd is set to 0,007 (7 centimeters?). The default value is 0,02 (centimeters?)
For me the room is 10x10 meters large watched through the Gear VR
If the object are near the camera they appear to be very large.

There is a no natural perspective in the scene, near objects appear enormous, far objects too much distant.
The Gear VR lenses distortion is wrong compensated.
I hope you have understood.
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Re: Serious scale issue

Postby ristoraven » Tue Jun 16, 2015 7:02 pm

ristoraven Tue Jun 16, 2015 7:02 pm
Strange.. See if you can change the units that are used, so that you can type in 65 mm for the IPD and not guess the correct value.. ?
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Re: Serious scale issue

Postby ristoraven » Tue Jun 16, 2015 7:07 pm

ristoraven Tue Jun 16, 2015 7:07 pm
Try this with GearVR.. To me, this ref model is close at least to real world with 65 mm ipd

viewtopic.php?f=99&t=47237

So if this is way off to you, then there's something crazy going on with hardware..
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Re: Serious scale issue

Postby gabrielefx » Tue Jun 16, 2015 9:07 pm

gabrielefx Tue Jun 16, 2015 9:07 pm
ristoraven wrote:Try this with GearVR.. To me, this ref model is close at least to real world with 65 mm ipd

viewtopic.php?f=99&t=47237

So if this is way off to you, then there's something crazy going on with hardware..

I use 3ds Max and I respect the scene units.
I don't know if there are tricks to do correct cubic renders with the right proportions.
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Re: Serious scale issue

Postby roeland » Wed Jun 17, 2015 2:39 am

roeland Wed Jun 17, 2015 2:39 am
gabrielefx wrote:
ristoraven wrote:Try this with GearVR.. To me, this ref model is close at least to real world with 65 mm ipd

viewtopic.php?f=99&t=47237

So if this is way off to you, then there's something crazy going on with hardware..

I use 3ds Max and I respect the scene units.
I don't know if there are tricks to do correct cubic renders with the right proportions.

There's not much proportions you can change when doing a cube render. You always just render a full panorama, the view angle on one face is always 90°. You can change the IPD, to have a 65mm distance you need to set the value in the camera node to 0.065 . A value of 0.007 would make the scene appear huge, 0.02 a bit less so. If you're after realistic depth you should use values between 0.055 and 0.075 . In landscapes sometimes a much higher value is used to have at least some depth perception for objects far away from the camera.

Being careful with the scale of objects is important, as others noted. You notice very quickly if objects are scaled even slightly different. Other than that, put the camera at a realistic eye height, and make sure the camera is exactly horizontal (use the "Keep upright" option).

One thing you have in real life, but never with a panoramic image like this, is parallax when moving your head sideways. It's currently also not possible to keep the 3D-stereo effect when looking up or down. So moving your head sideways may be weird.

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Re: Serious scale issue

Postby gabrielefx » Wed Jun 17, 2015 6:43 am

gabrielefx Wed Jun 17, 2015 6:43 am
Ok, thank you.
I thought that the ipd scale followed the scene scale...
Why have you set it to centimeters?

I will re render all my scenes again to check the effect.

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