OctaneRender® for Poser beta - build 1.02s [OBSOLETE]

Forums: OctaneRender® for Poser beta - build 1.02s [OBSOLETE]
Poser (Integrated Plugin developed by Paul Kinnane)

Moderator: face_off

Forum rules
Please keep character renders sensibly modest, please do not post sexually explicit scenes of characters.

Re: OctaneRender® for Poser beta - build 1.02s [CURRENT]

Postby Ken1171 » Mon Mar 11, 2013 5:32 pm

Ken1171 Mon Mar 11, 2013 5:32 pm
wimvdb wrote:I think you can remove the lips in the plugin configuration file (remove it from the list). It is usually the same textures are used and often it is just a small adaptation (if at all). So removing it from the plugin would not be a good idea for everyone

The Scene Texture Counter script in the Octane plugin scripts for Poser tells you where and which bump maps are used. That is a good start
Other thing you have to watch out for is "double" use of textures. If the same map is connected to the diffuse and the bump map channels, two maps are created: Image and Float_Image. Copy the Image node into the Float_Image node and you save a slot (you have to do that for all references before it becomes free)


Thank you for the heads up! I will try removing the LIP from the configuration XML. I always give lips a completely different shader, since its appearance and color look nothing like the rest of regular skin. ^___^

I will also use the Scene Texture Counter script to help locating the offending maps. And thanks for the hint on double maps, for things like that might be common in Poser scenes but I never had to worry about that until CUDA limitations came out. Having only 32 grayscale maps in a scene is WAY more serious than having your entire scene fitting into your video card memory. Nowadays I often blow the CUDA texture maps count limit way before my video card runs out of memory! -_____-
Ken1171
Licensed Customer
Licensed Customer
 
Posts: 145
Joined: Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:41 pm

Re: OctaneRender® for Poser beta - build 1.02s [CURRENT]

Postby wimvdb » Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:12 pm

wimvdb Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:12 pm
My previous videocard had 32 grayscale maps (GTX580) - it was too little for what I wanted to do.
Now I have a GTC680 and have 68 grayscale and 144 color maps. Even that is not enought with large props like Urban Spraw II from Stonemason. What I do now is dump the bumpmaps from anything which is further away from the camera. I also hide things not in view (saves memory AND texture slots). This way I can get scenes with 5 or 6 figure with clothing and lots of props in. It looks pretty good

Here another tip: If you are running low on texture slots - consider changing clothing or hair if possible. Some hair uses only 1 texture and transmap and others use a lot more (commonly 3 for color, 3 for bump and 3 for transmap)
Configuration: Windows 10 64bit Creators Edition, I7 6850K, 128GB, 2 GeForce 1080ti, P11 Pro SR6
wimvdb
Licensed Customer
Licensed Customer
 
Posts: 312
Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2012 2:03 pm

Re: OctaneRender® for Poser beta - build 1.02s [CURRENT]

Postby Ken1171 » Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:43 pm

Ken1171 Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:43 pm
wimvdb wrote:My previous videocard had 32 grayscale maps (GTX580) - it was too little for what I wanted to do.
Now I have a GTC680 and have 68 grayscale and 144 color maps. Even that is not enought with large props like Urban Spraw II from Stonemason. What I do now is dump the bumpmaps from anything which is further away from the camera. I also hide things not in view (saves memory AND texture slots). This way I can get scenes with 5 or 6 figure with clothing and lots of props in. It looks pretty good


Unfortunately my video card *is* a GTX580 3Gb Ultra+ Classified, so my CUDA limit is still 32 grayscale maps and there is nothing I can do about it. I can barely render a single character, and often had to drop bump maps and replace them (with dubious results) with Octane procedural maps. If the clothing has lace, then things get even worse because dropping transparency maps is not an option. As you've mentioned, hair can be an issue because most of the ones I've used with Octane include multiple transmaps, which drain the texture map slots pretty quickly even before the figure is dressed or a backdrop is added. Once again, removing those transmaps is not an option.

Considering we can assume that most other people have lesser video cards than a high-end GTX580 with even less video memory (mine has 3Gb), Octane is definitely prohibitive to most Poser users because of the CUDA GPU rendering limits. I noticed I barely used any video memory but Octane is already claiming some materials will not render, and it's usually the ones that depend on grayscale maps.

This is unfortunate because I have spent $380 dollars on something I can only use in some smaller scenes. I was really happy with Octane, but frankly, now that I came to terms with CUDA limitations that no one can do nothing about, I wish I could have my money back... -______-
Ken1171
Licensed Customer
Licensed Customer
 
Posts: 145
Joined: Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:41 pm

Re: OctaneRender® for Poser beta - build 1.02s [CURRENT]

Postby face_off » Mon Mar 11, 2013 9:13 pm

face_off Mon Mar 11, 2013 9:13 pm
Considering we can assume that most other people have lesser video cards than a high-end GTX580 with even less video memory (mine has 3Gb), Octane is definitely prohibitive to most Poser users because of the CUDA GPU rendering limits.

The 500 series certainly limits Poser users, because Poser content seems to use many more texturemaps than other 3d apps. So the 600 series cards are definitely the way to go (and what we have been recommending in this forum). Unfortunately for 3ds, Maya, etc users, the 500 series cards are still preferred, so getting recommended, which is misleading to Poser users.

Having said that, I have a 500 series card, and have yet to do a scene which exceeds the Cuda texture limits. So it really depends on the types of scenes you are doing. And from time to time a user will send me a huge scene for testing, and it's usually just a matter of running the Scene Texture Counter to see how far over things are, and then delete all the bump maps for certain props if required and make 1 or 2 props invisible and it loads. Also, a turbulence node will give a better skin bump map then most packaged skin bump maps, so you can save a huge number of grayscale maps that way. Also, if there is no bump map for skin, the plugin will use the texturemap (as an "image"), so that doesn't take up any slots.

So in summary, IMO you can still work with the 580, but you just need to be wise about the scene metrics.

If you have a specific example scene - post a screenshot here, along with the output from the Scene Texture Counter, and we can offer suggestions for fitting in the textureslots limits.

Paul
Win7/Win10/Mavericks/Mint 17 - GTX550Ti/GT640M
Octane Plugin Support : Poser, ArchiCAD, Revit, Inventor, AutoCAD, Rhino, Modo, Nuke, DAZ Studio
Pls read before submitting a support question
User avatar
face_off
Octane Plugin Developer
Octane Plugin Developer
 
Posts: 13554
Joined: Fri May 25, 2012 10:52 am
Location: Adelaide, Australia

Re: OctaneRender® for Poser beta - build 1.02s [CURRENT]

Postby Ken1171 » Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:20 pm

Ken1171 Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:20 pm
face_off wrote:So in summary, IMO you can still work with the 580, but you just need to be wise about the scene metrics. If you have a specific example scene - post a screenshot here, along with the output from the Scene Texture Counter, and we can offer suggestions for fitting in the textureslots limits.


That is exactly my point - I can still use Octane but only if my scene can cope with up to 32 graycale maps. In my last render http://ken1171.deviantart.com/art/From-Nyanna-with-Love-358222578 there was only a single figure (Vicky 4) and I already had to sacrifice bump maps all over. I assume this was because the clothing relied mainly on transparency maps, which along with the hair blew the 32 CUDA grayscale maps limits in a jiffy. I hence had to replace the room she was in with a plain backdrop just to have Octane quit moaning about the CUDA limits.

I have condensed all texture maps that were repeated, and reused specular maps as bump maps (ugh!, there goes my pretty skin shader), and basically removed almost all the bump maps until I came down to 32 grayscale maps total, replacing what could be replaced with Octane procedural maps (with dubious results). There was nothing I could do about the hair because transmaps cannot be removed or replaced by procedural textures.

At this point things are no fun anymore, for I am instead fighting the CUDA limits just to have a single character rendered. The lace details were lost because the grayscale bump maps just had to go, and Octane doesn't support procedural noise nodes we have in poser. Bump maps didn't work very well to replace specular maps, so my skin shader looks rather flat. And just forget about putting 2 or more characters in the scene, unless this was a nude beach scene - but nude is not my stuff. Maybe this would be possible if I carefully select clothing (and hair) that won't blow the 32 grayscale CUDA maps.

As for the GTX580, I indeed use it with 3DSMAX. By the time I bought this card last year, there was no GTX680 model that would ship with more than 1Gb or a more robust cooling solution (like the GTX580 Classified has). The hardware reviews also poorly rated the GTX680 in CUDA performance, claiming the older GTX580 still performed it in basically all benchmarks. At the time it seemed like a bad investment. nVidia blames the drivers for the low CUDA performance, but there are rumors that nVidia has intentionally crippled the CUDA performance to protect their higher end Quadro cards from loosing the competition, since they ship with way less streaming processors but cost a lot more.

In any case, to assume that people should buy the latest and greatest high-end video card (around $500) is not quite reasonable these days. I probably just did a poor deal with Octane when I consider the cost/benefit. Only 32 grayscale maps is just not enough... -_______-
Ken1171
Licensed Customer
Licensed Customer
 
Posts: 145
Joined: Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:41 pm

Re: OctaneRender® for Poser beta - build 1.02s [CURRENT]

Postby wimvdb » Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:46 pm

wimvdb Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:46 pm
There is one thing you may not know. You CAN use the graymaps with an Image node. So if you have textures slots left, you can move some of the Float_Image grayscales or transmaps to the Image set. Set the gamma to 1 and you are all set. The only disadvantage is that it takes more memory, but you have enough of that with 3GB
Configuration: Windows 10 64bit Creators Edition, I7 6850K, 128GB, 2 GeForce 1080ti, P11 Pro SR6
wimvdb
Licensed Customer
Licensed Customer
 
Posts: 312
Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2012 2:03 pm

Re: OctaneRender® for Poser beta - build 1.02s [CURRENT]

Postby wimvdb » Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:49 pm

wimvdb Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:49 pm
But the 680 does make a big difference for Poser users.
This image http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/ ... &member&np was rendered in Octane
Configuration: Windows 10 64bit Creators Edition, I7 6850K, 128GB, 2 GeForce 1080ti, P11 Pro SR6
wimvdb
Licensed Customer
Licensed Customer
 
Posts: 312
Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2012 2:03 pm

Re: OctaneRender® for Poser beta - build 1.02s [CURRENT]

Postby badmilk69 » Mon Mar 11, 2013 11:12 pm

badmilk69 Mon Mar 11, 2013 11:12 pm
Thats the reason why i sold my two 570 1.2gb now i have 2 670 4gb and everything is fine, more textures and more VRAM to play with.
i7 2600, 16 GB RAM, 2x Evga 670 SC 4gb, dual boot win7/osxML, 2 SSDs, 3 HDs.
badmilk69
Licensed Customer
Licensed Customer
 
Posts: 122
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 4:24 am

Re: OctaneRender® for Poser beta - build 1.02s [CURRENT]

Postby Ken1171 » Mon Mar 11, 2013 11:36 pm

Ken1171 Mon Mar 11, 2013 11:36 pm
wimvdb wrote:There is one thing you may not know. You CAN use the graymaps with an Image node. So if you have textures slots left, you can move some of the Float_Image grayscales or transmaps to the Image set. Set the gamma to 1 and you are all set. The only disadvantage is that it takes more memory, but you have enough of that with 3GB


That is indeed very useful info, thanks! I saw that in the Octane manual but didn't know it could help with the 32 grayscale CUDA limit. So if I change a "floatimage" into an "image" node, it will remove it from the grayscale buffer and put it into the video memory? Hmm, makes me wonder why don't we already have an option in Octane to do this transfer whenever we run out of CUDA grayscale buffers? It's not like we have any other option?

My suggestions for the next Octane update:

SUGGESTION 1: Octane plugin should have an option to convert selected "floatimage" into an "image" node whenever possible to save grayscale slots. I have only 32 slots, and other users with lesser cards might have even less.

SUGGESTION 2: When a material node that uses a texture map is changed to another node type that also requires a texture map, the current one should be automatically reused. In my attempts, I am asked to go hunt for whatever texture map was there before from a long list or from disk.
Ken1171
Licensed Customer
Licensed Customer
 
Posts: 145
Joined: Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:41 pm

Re: OctaneRender® for Poser beta - build 1.02s [CURRENT]

Postby Ken1171 » Mon Mar 11, 2013 11:42 pm

Ken1171 Mon Mar 11, 2013 11:42 pm
badmilk69 wrote:Thats the reason why i sold my two 570 1.2gb now i have 2 670 4gb and everything is fine, more textures and more VRAM to play with.


When I bought my GTX580 3Gb last year, the only GTX680 that existed was 1Gb or less, so I didn't really have a choice. Besides, I have already lost a GTX480 to GPU rendering overheating. Those stock coolers are not enough to withstand GPU rendering. That's why I bought the GTX580 Ultra+ Classified, because it ships with higher grade solid state capacitors, plus a heavy-duty cooler solution. At that time, the GTX680 only existed in stock cooler versions, so it wouldn't last very long.
Ken1171
Licensed Customer
Licensed Customer
 
Posts: 145
Joined: Sun Feb 10, 2013 11:41 pm
PreviousNext

Return to Poser


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests

Thu Nov 14, 2019 2:22 pm [ UTC ]