v1.0.111 beta issues

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DAZ Studio (Export Script Plugin developed by Tugpsx; Integrated Plugin maintained by Paul Kinnane)

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v1.0.111 beta issues

Postby SimonJM » Thu Mar 28, 2013 2:25 pm

SimonJM Thu Mar 28, 2013 2:25 pm
First off, great product! Resolves a fair few issues I had using the standalone Octane engine ... well, standalone ... :)

A couple of minor 'gripes':

The installation of the plug-in seems to impact the definition of each and every camera, giving them, by default, DoF set to on, a focal length of 65 and an f-stop pf 5.0. Admittedly that is probably more realistic, but it does kind of assume that each and every render you'll be doing is going to be via Octane :)
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Re: v1.0.111 beta issues

Postby t_3 » Thu Mar 28, 2013 3:00 pm

t_3 Thu Mar 28, 2013 3:00 pm
SimonJM wrote:First off, great product! Resolves a fair few issues I had using the standalone Octane engine ... well, standalone ... :)

A couple of minor 'gripes':

The installation of the plug-in seems to impact the definition of each and every camera, giving them, by default, DoF set to on, a focal length of 65 and an f-stop pf 5.0. Admittedly that is probably more realistic, but it does kind of assume that each and every render you'll be doing is going to be via Octane :)

thanks... and...

the cameras:
- afaik 65 is the default fov of a daz camera - this one is not actively tampered by the plugin though; the plugin uses the whatever fov set in a daz camera to calculate the octane fov (which is different); if the plugin does alter this setting, it is probably unwanted and a bug ;)

- f/stop and dof... this is indeed altered by the plugin, and it needs to do that because octane uses a numerical aperture value, being something completely different than the f/stop. every new camera needs to be grabbed by the plugin and sync'ed to octane, otherwise it won't be possible to use it, and to do this, it'll amongst others change f/stop and the DOF switch.

a personal opinion about the default f/stop and dof values: their default setting is - ever since the same - just because 3Delight did not render any depth of field effect for quite some time, and a f/stop of 22 would just closely match a non-existing DOF (this plus DOF off) ;)
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Re: v1.0.111 beta issues

Postby Laticis » Thu Mar 28, 2013 3:16 pm

Laticis Thu Mar 28, 2013 3:16 pm
Thanks, been looking forward to this Plugin for DAZ.

The plugin is certainly affecting the cameras, Focal Distance control is the main issue for me.

Solution for now:
Help / About Installed Plugins / Un-Tick Octane/ Restart DAZ and Cameras are back to default for normal DAZ Render.

Reverse process to get Octane back.
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Re: v1.0.111 beta issues

Postby Laticis » Thu Mar 28, 2013 3:40 pm

Laticis Thu Mar 28, 2013 3:40 pm
I really do like the Focal Control DAZ Cameras can give me.

Please see attached and link below to image.

http://laticis.deviantart.com/art/Step- ... -327524986
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DAZ-Focal-Cam.jpg
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Re: v1.0.111 beta issues

Postby t_3 » Thu Mar 28, 2013 3:59 pm

t_3 Thu Mar 28, 2013 3:59 pm
i admit, focal distance control is too much centered to octane when using the plugin. but this should be possible to change. i will need some time to find a practial solution to get this done with all the different focus modes the plugin provides.

f/stop on the other hand has no practical solution - at least if daz f/stop and octane aperture should be connected.

imo they should be, because they mean the same thing only by different parameters.
but if you need to set a f/stop of 200 to get nice dof with 3delight, they might better be not connected, because this number is totally weird and way off from anything in real world camera operating ;)

my thinking was, that the f/stop parameter is in general easier to use for people, since it's outcome is known from real world experience, whereas the "aperture" value in octane is something pretty abstract. thus i decided to put them together.

so the maybe best solution would be to let alone daz f/stop, and provide another f/stop slider for octane, which does internally calculate the aperture from it - what do you think?
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Re: v1.0.111 beta issues

Postby SimonJM » Thu Mar 28, 2013 4:28 pm

SimonJM Thu Mar 28, 2013 4:28 pm
LOL, I was just going to pretty much suggest the same thing!

I think I got a little turned round over the focal length as the camera settings get a little altered by Octane with the actual parameter I was thinking of (Focal distance) being hived off to sit under the OctaneRender sub-parameters.

So far as I know the f-stop parameter native to DS cameras bears no resemblance to real life, so I suspect as you mention leaving that alone and only affecting DS would be a good idea. Mind you, that then means a similar-named, un-linked, parameter specific to Octane ... hmmm, thorny issue! Could you 'take a stab' at conversion as/when DoF is set on, or having a 'Convert f-stop' button? How you'd convert'd be a bit of a stab in the dark, but I presume it'd be possible to do with ranges, setting the 'real' f-stop to Octane minimum when DS < 1, to Octane max when > 100 and suitable dealing with the in-bewteen bits? ;)
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Re: v1.0.111 beta issues

Postby t_3 » Thu Mar 28, 2013 4:44 pm

t_3 Thu Mar 28, 2013 4:44 pm
SimonJM wrote:LOL, I was just going to pretty much suggest the same thing!

I think I got a little turned round over the focal length as the camera settings get a little altered by Octane with the actual parameter I was thinking of (Focal distance) being hived off to sit under the OctaneRender sub-parameters.
it's because this is actually the octane focal distance slider, and the one of the daz camera gets hidden. now i also know why i did this. it is just one of a myriad of tiny problems doing this integration: daz studio alters the focal distance all the time under specific circumstances if you move the camera. and it doesn't do it in a senseful way, since it seems to always use a non-user-controllable camera target to calculate the focal distance. from my experiance, especially if watching the outcome live in the octane viewport (what you will never see rendering stills in 3delight), it looks plain erratic. in the end i decided to completely grab control of this parameter, add focus to and focus follow modes, to make best out of what is there.

what imo would be needed to basically leave it this way, but make it work better:
- more comfortable slider range settings; the current range doesn't allow any fine tuning by moving the slider ;)
- mapping back the octane focal distance to the daz camera, actually oversteering it; this way you will...
- - be able to control it via the visible focal plane again
- - have it in sync in octane and for 3deligth (or others ;))
- - be able to still use octane autofocus, focus to and focus follow modes

SimonJM wrote:So far as I know the f-stop parameter native to DS cameras bears no resemblance to real life, so I suspect as you mention leaving that alone and only affecting DS would be a good idea. Mind you, that then means a similar-named, un-linked, parameter specific to Octane ... hmmm, thorny issue! Could you 'take a stab' at conversion as/when DoF is set on, or having a 'Convert f-stop' button? How you'd convert'd be a bit of a stab in the dark, but I presume it'd be possible to do with ranges, setting the 'real' f-stop to Octane minimum when DS < 1, to Octane max when > 100 and suitable dealing with the in-bewteen bits? ;)
yes, that was what bugged me too - having a parameter twice always makes users unsure about what to use and why; hamlet - you know? seems it always turns out to end in a drama :D

will think about what might be a good solution for most people, and 'am interested in further/other opinions about this. since camera works is quite important for doing great renders, the camera settings imo need to be as intuitive yet flexible as possible...
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Re: v1.0.111 beta issues

Postby linvanchene » Thu Mar 28, 2013 5:09 pm

linvanchene Thu Mar 28, 2013 5:09 pm
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Last edited by linvanchene on Sat Sep 06, 2014 11:44 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: v1.0.111 beta issues

Postby Laticis » Thu Mar 28, 2013 5:13 pm

Laticis Thu Mar 28, 2013 5:13 pm
I do a lot of work in DAZ and would like the ability (if possible) to be able to turn DAZ Cameras and Octane Cameras on and off.
Bringing a real world camera to DAZ is brilliant and makes sense, but sometimes the real world just aint enough and long time users of DS have been using its cameras for sometime now.
Flexibilty to switch between the both is the key.

Control via visible focal plains work great in my opinion.

The ZBrush DOF Technique is not a bad system either offering two target points.
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Re: v1.0.111 beta issues

Postby t_3 » Thu Mar 28, 2013 5:48 pm

t_3 Thu Mar 28, 2013 5:48 pm
thanks for all your input so far!

i will think through this, and post a summary of things i can or will do, to optimize this area. will need some time, since next priority is a round of bug fixing and doing stability improvements....
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